[00:00:00 - 00:00:04]	 [
[00:00:04 - 00:00:08]	 All right. Can you hear in the back?
[00:00:08 - 00:00:14]	 Yeah, is the sound comfortable for everyone?
[00:00:14 - 00:00:18]	 Is the light comfortable for everyone?
[00:00:18 - 00:00:21]	 And are you comfortable?
[00:00:21 - 00:00:27]	 Well, you shouldn't be. The planet's going to shit in a handbag.
[00:00:29 - 00:00:35]	 No, that's just my John Lilly imitation. Not me at all.
[00:00:35 - 00:00:39]	 I'll circulate these now.
[00:00:39 - 00:00:44]	 If you're interested in an intensive rainforest,
[00:00:44 - 00:00:52]	 definitely psychobotany intensity, that's Palenque in the state of Chiapas next January.
[00:00:53 - 00:01:01]	 Why, and you haven't gotten one of those, there it is, and then that gets the hype out of the way right at the beginning.
[00:01:01 - 00:01:15]	 So, most of you were probably at the talk I gave yesterday. Is that basically safe to assume?
[00:01:15 - 00:01:16]	 Yeah.
[00:01:16 - 00:01:29]	 So, I thought today I would talk a little bit, and then I think these things are much more interesting for me if they're interactive.
[00:01:29 - 00:01:34]	 And people bring all kinds of agendas to these things.
[00:01:34 - 00:01:39]	 And I don't know whether people want to talk philosophy or recipes.
[00:01:39 - 00:01:51]	 I don't know whether they want to talk politics or, you know, share experiences.
[00:01:51 - 00:02:01]	 So, I want to just, in order to make sure we all understand the domain we're operating from here,
[00:02:01 - 00:02:09]	 I would like to talk a little bit about what it's like to be loaded in all,
[00:02:09 - 00:02:15]	 because I think that's the ground zero of what we're talking about.
[00:02:15 - 00:02:23]	 Psychedelics are like any other social phenomena. There are a lot of wannabes.
[00:02:23 - 00:02:27]	 There are a lot of people who are along for the ride.
[00:02:27 - 00:02:36]	 I'm sure the pagan community is no stranger to this phenomenon because there are certain residual spin-offs
[00:02:36 - 00:02:46]	 if you proclaim yourself pagan that are hard to obtain any other way, similarly for being psychedelic.
[00:02:46 - 00:02:54]	 So, some of you have heard me do this before, but it's a personal thing,
[00:02:54 - 00:02:57]	 and yet it's a general thing.
[00:02:57 - 00:03:07]	 My notion of the psychedelic cosmogony, if you want to think of it that way, is it's like a bullseye.
[00:03:07 - 00:03:19]	 It's like a series of concentric circles, and various substances place you in various quadrants of that mandala
[00:03:19 - 00:03:28]	 at various distances from ground zero, which is at the absolute center.
[00:03:28 - 00:03:35]	 And nature in her bounty has provided various coordination points.
[00:03:35 - 00:03:44]	 I mean, there's the cannabis coordination point, the opiate coordination point,
[00:03:44 - 00:03:53]	 the tropanes that were so important in European witchcraft, the solanaceous plants, phyocyanin, those things.
[00:03:53 - 00:04:06]	 That's a different chemical family and a different group of plant families that these compounds occur in.
[00:04:06 - 00:04:15]	 And, you know, I've been at this fairly steadily since 1964,
[00:04:15 - 00:04:26]	 and I've tried to do everything with a certain level of attention and reverence,
[00:04:26 - 00:04:33]	 because I think that, you know, it's all very fine to go armed with the knowledge of pharmacology,
[00:04:33 - 00:04:37]	 dose response, LD50 and all that.
[00:04:37 - 00:04:46]	 But I think as pagans and magicians, we really understand that the mind can do anything.
[00:04:46 - 00:04:55]	 And there's a horribly frightening little passage in Jung somewhere where he says,
[00:04:55 - 00:05:04]	 "The unconscious has a thousand ways to terminate a life that has become meaningless," meaning, you know,
[00:05:04 - 00:05:08]	 you'll step in front of a streetcar or something.
[00:05:08 - 00:05:20]	 So, in my lifetime of looking at these things and being interested in many other things as well,
[00:05:20 - 00:05:30]	 the hilarity of pure backwaters of our history and literature,
[00:05:30 - 00:05:41]	 of peculiar philosophies that rose and fell centuries ago in obscure parts of the world,
[00:05:41 - 00:05:51]	 my theory of life exploration is to run edges, and I've mellowed over the years,
[00:05:51 - 00:05:57]	 but I used to say if a book isn't 100 years old, you shouldn't read it.
[00:05:57 - 00:06:01]	 If a person isn't dead, you shouldn't worry about them.
[00:06:01 - 00:06:09]	 If they wrote in English, you shouldn't bother with them, and so forth and so on.
[00:06:09 - 00:06:25]	 In the course of sorting out as many peculiar and bizarre possibilities that life could offer me in many places,
[00:06:25 - 00:06:30]	 my attitude was always critical.
[00:06:30 - 00:06:35]	 My attitude was always the show me attitude.
[00:06:35 - 00:06:39]	 I don't believe in faith. I don't believe in belief.
[00:06:39 - 00:06:50]	 My favorite gospel story is the story of the Apostle Thomas, who was not present when Christ came the first time
[00:06:50 - 00:06:57]	 after the resurrection to the upper room, and then later Thomas came to the apostles,
[00:06:57 - 00:07:07]	 and they said the master has been here, and he said you guys have been smoking too much of that red lamb,
[00:07:07 - 00:07:19]	 and then Christ came again, but in this conversation with the Apostle Thomas said unless I put my hand into the wound,
[00:07:19 - 00:07:32]	 I will not believe it, and then time passed, and then Christ came again to the upper room, and he said Thomas, come forward.
[00:07:32 - 00:07:40]	 Put your hand into the wound, and he did, and then he said Lord, I am not worthy, so forth and so on.
[00:07:40 - 00:07:51]	 My conclusion about this story is that alone among all humanity in all times and places,
[00:07:51 - 00:08:02]	 only one person ever touched the incorporeal body of God, Thomas the doubter touched because he doubted.
[00:08:02 - 00:08:18]	 It is not necessary that the believers should be about to say such a boon, but the doubter was awarded the supreme enlightenment.
[00:08:18 - 00:08:21]	 Okay, so much for that.
[00:08:21 - 00:08:31]	 So my thing has always been, but as you present me with a diet, a social arrangement, society, a sexual conundrum,
[00:08:31 - 00:08:49]	 a work of art, my criteria is is it shit or is it chinola, and I'm happy to give you the benefit of my personal life experience
[00:08:49 - 00:09:02]	 proceeding along those lines. I want to talk about what to my mind is the quintessential palisthenogen, and consequently,
[00:09:02 - 00:09:14]	 the quintessential spiritual and magical tool of this dimension, and that is DMT, dimethyltryptamine,
[00:09:14 - 00:09:23]	 a compound that occurs in the human nervous system. It occurs in many, many plants.
[00:09:23 - 00:09:34]	 It is the commonest palisthenogen in all of nature, and I don't know how you got to where you are this afternoon,
[00:09:34 - 00:09:53]	 but the way I got here is by testing and by hoping and by pursuing a magical, that's the word, a miraculous, a transcendental ideal
[00:09:53 - 00:10:03]	 that over the course of life experiences from you. You know, you have to get a job, your first love,
[00:10:03 - 00:10:18]	 if not your last love. Slowly this pristine, shining belief in perfectibility is eroded by the swings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
[00:10:18 - 00:10:30]	 you know, the dark thoughts and the turn of the millstones of the world. But you hear the value that it is real.
[00:10:30 - 00:10:49]	 There is a doorway into another dimension. Aladdin's lamp is real. Fairyland is real. Magic is real in the most real sense,
[00:10:49 - 00:11:08]	 in the same sense that what we call reality is real, and I learned this through this compound, and one of the great puzzles about this compound
[00:11:08 - 00:11:27]	 is why more people don't know about this. No brotherhood initiated me. No lineage reaching back to the fall of Atlantis brought me into its circle.
[00:11:27 - 00:11:39]	 Therefore, I feel completely free to say anything I want. Nobody has ever come to me and said, "You are spilling the beans.
[00:11:39 - 00:11:52]	 You are telling the secret." A long, long time ago, and you know, we all have different opinions. This is mine. I hope it doesn't descend.
[00:11:52 - 00:12:08]	 But a long, long time ago, I took an oath to tell all secrets that came my way. Don't tell me a secret. I won't keep it. I'm against secrets.
[00:12:08 - 00:12:21]	 I'm against hierarchies, lineages, all assumption of special knowledge on the part of anyone in the presence of anyone else is apparent in me.
[00:12:21 - 00:12:39]	 I mean, I am a true anarchist, first and foremost. So, the NT, like all things in this world, has a physical body, a presence, and a presentation.
[00:12:39 - 00:12:52]	 In this case, it looks rather like earwax. It is orange. It is crystalline. It smells vaguely of mothballs.
[00:12:52 - 00:13:09]	 And for my money, it is the lapis, the quintessence, the universal panacea at the end of time has sent a reflection back through the temporal labyrinth.
[00:13:09 - 00:13:17]	 And wherever this touches, wherever this compresses, the mystery is fully present.
[00:13:17 - 00:13:31]	 So, what is it then? Well, it's an experience. And I maintain it's the most intense experience you can have this size of the yawning grave.
[00:13:31 - 00:13:42]	 Without doubt, when people say, "Is it dangerous?" Well, the answer is only if you fear death by astonishment.
[00:13:42 - 00:13:51]	 [Laughter] Yes, that's a joke here. It's not a joke there.
[00:13:51 - 00:14:01]	 Because you find yourself literally holding your heart to verify that you have not in fact had a coronary thrombosis
[00:14:01 - 00:14:13]	 and you have been abused by wonder, terror, reverence, and astonishment. So, here it is, the quintessence, the orange thing.
[00:14:13 - 00:14:26]	 Was it transponded in from Arturus? Was it handed down through some ancient eldritch brotherhood that found this secret before the pyramids were built?
[00:14:26 - 00:14:45]	 Who can say, "Whatever it is, wherever it comes from, here's what happens when you allow it to pass through the blood-brain barrier of your own alchemical vessel, which is your body."
[00:14:45 - 00:14:57]	 The first thing that happens is that there is a sense as though all the air in the room has been sucked out. All the colors brightening.
[00:14:57 - 00:15:10]	 This is that increase in visual acuity that I made so much of yesterday. All edges become sharp. Distant things stand out in their clarity.
[00:15:10 - 00:15:23]	 This is at one toke. At two tokes, you close your eyes. You feel a sense of anesthesia seeping through your body.
[00:15:23 - 00:15:32]	 You close your eyes and you see a floral pattern rotating in space, usually yellow-orange.
[00:15:32 - 00:15:45]	 People who do this occasionally, and nobody does it a lot, call it the chrysanthemum. It's a floral pattern, like a pattern in a Chinese brocade.
[00:15:45 - 00:15:57]	 This forms and stabilizes, and then you either break through it or you require one more toke.
[00:15:57 - 00:16:10]	 These are matters of physiology, shamanic intent, so forth and so on. The leather-lunged hash smokers among us have a leg up in this department.
[00:16:10 - 00:16:24]	 This is a spiritual discipline where the ability not to cough makes the difference between shunyata and try again.
[00:16:24 - 00:16:35]	 So you take, let us assume, a third toke long and slow through a glass pipe until you vaporize this stuff.
[00:16:35 - 00:16:40]	 You don't mix it with weed or oregano or any of that, which was done in the past.
[00:16:40 - 00:16:51]	 You want the pure stuff, and you take it in and in and in, and there is definitely somewhere in here a threshold,
[00:16:51 - 00:17:02]	 a threshold which you must exceed, and when you do that, this membrane-like thing, this chrysanthemum will actually part,
[00:17:02 - 00:17:11]	 and there is a sound like the crumpling of a plastic bread wrapper or the crackling of a plane.
[00:17:11 - 00:17:21]	 A friend of mine says this is the radio intellect key of your soul exiting through the anterior fontanelle at the top of your head.
[00:17:21 - 00:17:51]	 It could be, in any case, this crackling sound and a tone, a tone, a "NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN
[00:17:51 - 00:18:11]	 It's as though there were a series of tunnels or chambers that you are tumbling down, being propelled by some kind of muscle behind you that is pushing you, I mean, yeah, first canal, yes, yes, of course, but anyway, a tunnel,
[00:18:11 - 00:18:26]	 and what you notice about this tunnel is the walls and ceiling block and come down to meet each other, and where they touch, they pull apart with a,
[00:18:26 - 00:18:48]	 and you're propelled into the next space, and then the next, and then the next, and there is this, right, and then you are there,
[00:18:48 - 00:19:00]	 and this is what I want to talk to you about because of all communities, I hope perhaps collectively, that someone can say something enlightening about this.
[00:19:00 - 00:19:17]	 Then you are there, and where is there? It's underground. How you know this, you cannot say, but there is this irrepressible sense of enormous mass surrounding you.
[00:19:17 - 00:19:30]	 In other words, you are underground. You're at the center of a mountain or something, and you're in a room which aficionados call the dome, and people will ask each other,
[00:19:30 - 00:19:50]	 did you see the dome? Were you there? It's softly lit, indirectly lit, and the walls, such they be, are crawling with geometric hallucinations, very brightly colored,
[00:19:50 - 00:20:03]	 very iridescent with deep chains and very high reflective surfaces, everything is machine-like and polished and throbbing with energy.
[00:20:03 - 00:20:17]	 But that is not what immediately arrests my attention. What arrests my attention is the fact that this space is inhabited,
[00:20:17 - 00:20:33]	 that the immediate impression as you break into it is there is a cheer. The gnomes have learned a new way to say hooray.
[00:20:33 - 00:20:49]	 You break into this space and are immediately swarmed by tweaking, self-transforming elf machines, these things which are made of light and grammar
[00:20:49 - 00:21:05]	 and sound that come chirping and squealing and tumbling towards you, and they say hooray, welcome, you're here, and in my case you send so many, you come so rarely.
[00:21:05 - 00:21:22]	 And my immediate impression, no matter how many times I do this, and I've done it maybe 30 or 40 times, using the lock in a lifetime of worshiping it,
[00:21:22 - 00:21:40]	 my immediate impression is that they are welcoming. There is something going on which I, over the years, come to call love, L-U-V, not like utility vehicle,
[00:21:40 - 00:21:53]	 but love that is not like hero or not like sexual attraction. I don't know what it's like exactly. It's almost like a physical thing.
[00:21:53 - 00:22:05]	 It's like a glue that pours out into this space, and my immediate impression in there is I'm appalled. I'm appalled at how far I've come.
[00:22:05 - 00:22:22]	 And one of the strange things about DMT is that it does not affect your mind in the ordinary sense in that, you know, drugs, they make you giggly, they frighten you, they stimulate you, they depress you.
[00:22:22 - 00:22:38]	 DMT does none of this. You go to that place with all your groceries, you're there, and you're there thinking, Jesus H.Y. what is this? What is this?
[00:22:38 - 00:23:01]	 And you're thinking, I must be dead. I've done it this time. Psychedelic mantra, I've done it this time. I must be dead. And so you think heart, yes, heart, hope, hope, yes, yes.
[00:23:01 - 00:23:10]	 And meanwhile these things are literally in your face, and what they do is they jump into your chest, and then they jump out again.
[00:23:10 - 00:23:32]	 And what they're doing, and this is the point I think, what they're doing is they are singing, chanting, speaking in some kind of language that is very bizarre to hear.
[00:23:32 - 00:23:42]	 But what is far more important is that you can see it. They speak in the language that you see.
[00:23:42 - 00:23:53]	 And this is completely confounding because intact is not something you ordinarily reach out and touch.
[00:23:53 - 00:24:02]	 And in this space that's what's happening. And so like Jules self-dribbling basketballs, these things come running forward.
[00:24:02 - 00:24:14]	 And what they are doing with this visible language that they create is they're making gifts. They're making gifts for you.
[00:24:14 - 00:24:32]	 And they will say, "Beep, boogie, no boogie, no boogie, boop, beep, beep, beep, beep." Which again serves as something which looks like a cross between a soft-lipped camel, a Havana cigar, a piece of Babylonian, an opal, and just milkies.
[00:24:32 - 00:24:49]	 And they offer you a milk. And you're looking at this thing. And as you look at it, it also transforms, changes, speaks, sings, undergoes metastasis, undergoes metamorphosis.
[00:24:49 - 00:25:01]	 And these things are just accumulating. And each elf machine creature elbows others and says, "Look at this. Look at this. Take this. Choose me."
[00:25:01 - 00:25:21]	 And as you direct your attention into these things, you have the overwhelming conviction that if you could bring a single one of these objects back to this world, that somehow you wouldn't have to say anything.
[00:25:21 - 00:25:36]	 You would just walk up to people and say, "Friend?" And you would say, "Oh my God. You got a piece of the action. A real action."
[00:25:36 - 00:25:51]	 So this state of ecstatic frenzy, and it's like a bug bunny cartoon running backwards in timer space or something.
[00:25:51 - 00:26:02]	 This state of incredible frenzy goes on for about three minutes. And all the time the elves are saying, "Don't give way to wonder.
[00:26:02 - 00:26:21]	 Do not abandon yourself to amazement. Pay attention. Pay attention. Look at what we're doing. Look at what we're doing and then do it. Do it."
[00:26:21 - 00:26:37]	 And it's this thing where then everything stops and they wait and you feel like a torch, a spark lit in your belly that begins to move up your esophagus.
[00:26:37 - 00:26:52]	 And eventually when it reaches your mouth, your mouth just flies open and this language-like stuff comes out acoustically.
[00:26:52 - 00:27:22]	 It's "Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
[00:27:22 - 00:27:37]	 And you're putting up with this. What you're experiencing is a visual modality where these tones are surfaces, shading, colors, insects, jewels.
[00:27:37 - 00:27:54]	 And you are making something. "I tum jay fwa ha te, bulgin ha jay tu, thi thum na." You know, erase, move forward, add cerulean, putting stickling, that sort of thing.
[00:27:54 - 00:28:09]	 And they go mad with joy when you do this. And then, you know, this goes on for about 30 seconds and then there is like a ripple through the system.
[00:28:09 - 00:28:24]	 And you realize these two continua are being pulled apart. And I had one trip where the -- and often it's very erotic, although I'm not sure that's the word.
[00:28:24 - 00:28:32]	 But it's something -- it's almost like sex is the surface of something of which this is the volume.
[00:28:32 - 00:28:41]	 And I'm a great fan of sex. I don't mean to denigrate it. I mean to raise the empty to a very high standard.
[00:28:41 - 00:29:01]	 But it's astonishing. And one trip as the pull-away maneuver began, all the elves turned simultaneously and looked at me and said, "Deja vu. Deja vu."
[00:29:01 - 00:29:11]	 So this is an experience which in some form -- I mean it will be different for each one of you.
[00:29:11 - 00:29:19]	 But in some form, at least what will be similar to my description is how dramatic it will be.
[00:29:19 - 00:29:25]	 It will hit you as hard as it hit me if you do it right.
[00:29:25 - 00:29:36]	 This, to me, this experience is of a fundamentally different order than any other experience this side of the yawning grave.
[00:29:36 - 00:29:46]	 And why religions have not been built around it, why empires have not risen and fallen around the control of its sources,
[00:29:46 - 00:29:56]	 why theology has not enshrined it as its central exhibit for the presence of the other in the human world, I don't know.
[00:29:56 - 00:30:02]	 I can tell the secret. As you notice, nothing shuts me up.
[00:30:02 - 00:30:09]	 But why this is not orange headlines on every newspaper on the planet, I cannot understand,
[00:30:09 - 00:30:17]	 because I don't know what news you were waiting for, but this is the news that I was waiting for.
[00:30:17 - 00:30:25]	 [Applause]
[00:30:25 - 00:30:35]	 And it's an incredible challenge to human understanding to try and make sense of this.
[00:30:35 - 00:30:48]	 I started out, you know, reading Jung, doing my Hindu, you know, getting up to speed with all that, studying Zen Buddhism, studying Shamanism.
[00:30:48 - 00:30:56]	 The thing that puzzles me about DMT is how little trace there is of it in the human world.
[00:30:56 - 00:31:08]	 I can't point to a period in European art or the art of some group of islanders somewhere and say that is very much like DMT.
[00:31:08 - 00:31:19]	 It isn't. And yet the DMT thing, it's like an avalanche of orgasmic beauty, but a certain kind of beauty.
[00:31:19 - 00:31:29]	 The only words that I can find for the kind of beauty that it is is bizarre, alien, outlandish,
[00:31:29 - 00:31:38]	 freaky, and at the very edge of what the human mind seems to be able to hold.
[00:31:38 - 00:31:44]	 Well, where is this coming from and what is happening?
[00:31:44 - 00:31:56]	 And this is what I like to discuss with people such as yourself who have wide experience in the world and in the realms of the fan scene.
[00:31:56 - 00:32:02]	 It has to be taken seriously. In other words, it's only a hallucination thing.
[00:32:02 - 00:32:08]	 That or shit is just a pass say. I mean, reality is only a hallucination.
[00:32:08 - 00:32:15]	 I'm trying to try it out loud. Haven't you heard? So that takes care of that, the hallucination.
[00:32:15 - 00:32:32]	 What we've got here, folks, is an intelligent intellect of some sort that is granted to communicate with human beings for some reason.
[00:32:32 - 00:32:41]	 And the possibilities can be logically enumerated.
[00:32:41 - 00:32:50]	 And what we've got here is either this is an extraterrestrial, you know, evolved around a different star,
[00:32:50 - 00:33:00]	 possibly with a different biology, may not even be made of matter, came across an enormous distance some time maybe long ago,
[00:33:00 - 00:33:08]	 has some agenda which we may or may not be able to conceive of. This is it, the real thing.
[00:33:08 - 00:33:16]	 As the little girl said in Poltergeist, they're here. So that's one possibility. That's just one possibility.
[00:33:16 - 00:33:35]	 And I present these without judgment because I'm not sure if an extraterrestrial wanted to interact with the human society
[00:33:35 - 00:33:44]	 and it had ethics that forbade it from landing trillion-ton beryllium ships from the United Nations Plaza.
[00:33:44 - 00:33:53]	 In other words, if it were a sunken, I can see hiding yourself inside the shamanic intoxication.
[00:33:53 - 00:33:58]	 You would say, let's analyze these people. Okay, they're kind of hard-headed rationalists,
[00:33:58 - 00:34:07]	 except they have this phenomenon called getting loaded. And when they get loaded, they accept whatever happens to them.
[00:34:07 - 00:34:21]	 So let's hide inside the load and we'll talk to them from there and they'll never realize that we're of a different status than paint elephants.
[00:34:21 - 00:34:32]	 Okay, that's one possibility. Now another possibility is that this is not about extraterrestrial flight
[00:34:32 - 00:34:43]	 and enormous technologies and distant homeland. And this is maybe closer to Fenway or to Pagan's notion
[00:34:43 - 00:34:50]	 that there is a parallel continuum nearby, essentially right here.
[00:34:50 - 00:34:58]	 Call it fairyland, call it the Western realm, whatever you like, that you don't go there in a star ship.
[00:34:58 - 00:35:07]	 You go there through magical doorways which are opened via ritual and things like that.
[00:35:07 - 00:35:15]	 That is a possibility as well. Certainly human folklore in all times and places except Western Europe
[00:35:15 - 00:35:28]	 for the last 300 years has insisted that these parallel domains of intelligence and organization exist.
[00:35:28 - 00:35:37]	 There is a third possibility which I leave it to you to decide whether this is the more conservative position
[00:35:37 - 00:35:49]	 or the more radical position. And I reached this reluctantly and I'm not sure this is my position.
[00:35:49 - 00:36:01]	 These things have a weird type as I call them, these self-transforming machine elves, these syntactical homunculi
[00:36:01 - 00:36:11]	 have a very weird relationship to human beings. First of all, they love us. They care for some reason.
[00:36:11 - 00:36:17]	 Whoever and whatever they are, they're far more aware of us than we are aware of them.
[00:36:17 - 00:36:28]	 I mean witness the fact that they love us. So is it possible that at the end of the 20th century,
[00:36:28 - 00:36:40]	 at the end of 500 years of materialism, reductionism, positivism, what we're about to discover is probably
[00:36:40 - 00:36:51]	 the least likely been in law, any of us expected out of our dilemma. What we're about to discover is that death
[00:36:51 - 00:37:05]	 has no sting, that what you penetrate on DMT is an ecology of human soul in another dimension of some sort.
[00:37:05 - 00:37:13]	 I mean this is hair-raising to me and I've got my whole adolescence and early adulthood getting free from
[00:37:13 - 00:37:23]	 pathology and then into function. I never imagined that a thorough exploration of life and history would lead to
[00:37:23 - 00:37:36]	 the conclusion that in fact this is but a prelude. We are in a very tiny womb of some sort.
[00:37:36 - 00:37:49]	 Our lives are generations and this is not where we are destined to unfold ourselves into what it means to be human.
[00:37:49 - 00:37:58]	 This is some kind of a metamorphic stage like the pupil of a butterfly.
[00:37:58 - 00:38:14]	 And so this is deep water because we are fairly agitated over the fact that we fear the planet is dying and on its way.
[00:38:14 - 00:38:27]	 This raises the issue that you don't know what dying is. Therefore it's very uncertain exactly what sort of an attitude
[00:38:27 - 00:38:37]	 we should take to it. And as I say I am not advocating a position. Mysteries are not unsolved problems.
[00:38:37 - 00:38:47]	 They are mysteries and we can make it in the presence of the mystery. It is still utterly and completely mysterious.
[00:38:47 - 00:39:02]	 But I enjoy talking to people about this because I think that the human body, the human mind, these are tools for the soul to use
[00:39:02 - 00:39:15]	 in the effort to unlock its meaning and its destiny. And millions of people, perhaps billions of people, have gone to the grave
[00:39:15 - 00:39:25]	 without knowing that this is possible, this experience that I just described to you. And it's perfectly harmless.
[00:39:25 - 00:39:38]	 I mean I think that if science would back out of politics and do its work, we could establish that the DMT is the most harmless,
[00:39:38 - 00:39:52]	 the safest of all house energies. The fact that it occurs naturally in the human brain is the first clue to it, the fact that it's benign.
[00:39:52 - 00:40:07]	 The second clue is the fact that it only lasts eight to 12 minutes. What that means to a pharmacologist is the body perfectly understands
[00:40:07 - 00:40:17]	 what to do with its compounds. You take a hit of DMT and your body says, oh, I recognize this. Activate the animation cycle,
[00:40:17 - 00:40:26]	 activate demethylation cycle, activate it. It knows what to do. And so within ten minutes you're down.
[00:40:26 - 00:40:39]	 A drug that you take and 48 hours later you're lying around in warm baths and refusing telephone calls is a drug you shouldn't have taken
[00:40:39 - 00:40:49]	 because it's hitting you too hard. That's not clean, that's not clean. DMT, the most powerful,
[00:40:49 - 00:41:01]	 the most intelligent known to man and science, clears your system in 15 minutes. I mean you're so down, you don't have a small headache
[00:41:01 - 00:41:15]	 or need to take a nap or anything. You're ready to do phone calls. So how can it be then that the compounds which each of us carries
[00:41:15 - 00:41:26]	 right here, right in the pineal gland, right in the ajna chakra, the philosophers know this no further away than that.
[00:41:26 - 00:41:37]	 How can this be secret from us? How can we be trapped in a dimension of such limitation and such mundane-ness
[00:41:37 - 00:41:47]	 when our own nervous system and the ecology around us and our own history over the past half a million years
[00:41:47 - 00:41:56]	 argue that this is what we were born and bred for, this is where we belong, this is what that play in the fields of the god
[00:41:56 - 00:42:12]	 is what this must mean. And somehow history has made us dysfunctional, buried the mystery, made it at best a piece of secret knowledge
[00:42:12 - 00:42:21]	 jealously guarded by somebody. I mean I don't know, there are lots of mystery cults and secret societies in the world.
[00:42:21 - 00:42:32]	 I don't know if any of them are guarding DMT as a secret. I think maybe so. No one told me to keep mine out of the show.
[00:42:32 - 00:42:44]	 It's a very suggestive short story. I'm sure many of you know and love the Argentine surrealist writer Jorge Luis Borges.
[00:42:44 - 00:42:54]	 Well, Borges has a book, I believe it's called Labyrinth, and in Labyrinth there is a short story called The Sex of the Phoenix
[00:42:54 - 00:43:08]	 and it says there is a sacrament older than mankind. The sectarians have been the victims of every persecution in human history
[00:43:08 - 00:43:23]	 and the sectarians have been the purveyors of every persecution in history. These sectarians are not identifiable by race or place
[00:43:23 - 00:43:38]	 or language or time. To the adept the mystery appears ridiculous, yet they do not speak of it. One child can initiate another.
[00:43:38 - 00:43:53]	 It is orange, ruins are proficient places. Do it in the moonlight at the threshold of building and that's all it says.
[00:43:53 - 00:44:04]	 It's a page and a half and it's a guess and see here's the thing, I mean I'm not as articulate on this subject as I wish I could be.
[00:44:04 - 00:44:16]	 If this is not the secret that these lineages are guarding, then they're guarding an empty house. This is the secret.
[00:44:16 - 00:44:32]	 It is, it is. It cannot be anything else. It is the Neoplaton one. It is the Trans-Saxon object, the pan-Saxon of the Alcma.
[00:44:32 - 00:44:46]	 And I'm not saying that people have known about this for a long time. BMP is in many plants as I said, but spread very thinly.
[00:44:46 - 00:45:00]	 And we don't have historical records of anyone ever concentrating. I've done the BMP plant preparations of the Amazon, the Snuff and the Ayahuasca.
[00:45:00 - 00:45:12]	 And on Ayahuasca if it is heavily laced with the BMP containing plants, after hours of breast work and drumming alone in the jungle,
[00:45:12 - 00:45:24]	 you can begin to open it up to the place that BMP will carry you to in 45 seconds in an upper east side apartment whether you like it or not.
[00:45:24 - 00:45:40]	 So, and I mean, some of you may have seen years and years ago this B movie about a guy who has a big ranch in Mexico
[00:45:40 - 00:45:48]	 and one of the campesinos comes rushing back from having encountered a bronzosaur in the forest.
[00:45:48 - 00:46:00]	 And he can only point inarticulately at the words and say, "Something, something, something, something."
[00:46:00 - 00:46:16]	 And that's what I am. I'm a monkey. And I come back to the truth. And I'm telling you there's something over the next hill that is off the scale, off the scale.
[00:46:16 - 00:46:24]	 And I have made it my business to, you know, delve. I'm a delver. I'm a noetic archeologist.
[00:46:24 - 00:46:40]	 There's a pure heresy and strange rites and all of this stuff been there, done that. It's all pale soup compared to this.
[00:46:40 - 00:46:50]	 And so I type it to you. He said you can't go further into the barge and return.
[00:46:50 - 00:47:04]	 And so I think that we stand at the brink of an enormous frontier. Call it incorporeality. Call it non-material existence.
[00:47:04 - 00:47:13]	 Or, you know, bite the bullet. Call it death. But this is the frontier that we stand on the edge of.
[00:47:13 - 00:47:22]	 This is what history has been about. History has been some kind of suicide plot for 15,000 years.
[00:47:22 - 00:47:30]	 Not a moment passed that the plot would not advance closer and closer and closer and closer to completion.
[00:47:30 - 00:47:40]	 And now in the 20th century, you know, we see that this thing, this transcendental object at the end of time,
[00:47:40 - 00:47:55]	 this tractor that shows up out of the animal kingdom and sculpted the neocortex, opposed the thumb, stood up on our hind legs,
[00:47:55 - 00:48:04]	 gave us binocular vision. This thing is calling us towards itself across eons of cosmic time.
[00:48:04 - 00:48:10]	 We are asked to mirror it. And as we mirror it, we become more of a peasant.
[00:48:10 - 00:48:20]	 And as we become more of a peasant, we leave behind the animal organization that we were cast in in the beginning.
[00:48:20 - 00:48:29]	 And what this is about, who knows? You know, is this a drama of cosmic redemption?
[00:48:29 - 00:48:39]	 Is it the transcendental other at the end of time? Is it a Gnostic demon? Is it Ilgabwe? What is it?
[00:48:39 - 00:48:46]	 We do not know. But I really believe we are in the era when we will come to know.
[00:48:46 - 00:48:52]	 And what the psychedelics are, are periscopes in the temporal dimension.
[00:48:52 - 00:49:03]	 If you want to see a little bit into the future, elevate your psychedelic periscope outside of the three-dimensional continuum
[00:49:03 - 00:49:13]	 and peer around. For thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of years, we have been pulled towards this omega point.
[00:49:13 - 00:49:20]	 The earth is like an egg. It has come to its moment of fruitification.
[00:49:20 - 00:49:31]	 The dawn that has been anticipated since we were herding our cattle across the plains of Africa is now upon us.
[00:49:31 - 00:49:37]	 The east is streaked with the blush of rosy dawn. It is coming upon us.
[00:49:37 - 00:49:50]	 And I think that it will redeem history. That history is not a nightmare. It is a passage. It is an initiation.
[00:49:50 - 00:49:58]	 Think of the fetus in the womb at the moment of transition. Surely it must despair.
[00:49:58 - 00:50:07]	 The walls are closing in. It is being crushed and strangled. Gone are the endless, un-naotic oceans of a few months
[00:50:07 - 00:50:13]	 before, the weightlessness, the effortless delivery of food through the umbilical cord.
[00:50:13 - 00:50:22]	 Suddenly it is just boundary and agony and crushing pressure. That is where we are.
[00:50:22 - 00:50:31]	 And we are going to have to shed history like a snake sheds its skin if we want to slip off into hyperspace,
[00:50:31 - 00:50:42]	 where I think all of magical humanity is awaiting us and cheering us on, lending their weight.
[00:50:42 - 00:50:52]	 They're all out there, you know, Proclus, and Patainas, and Plato, and Hypatia, and Henry Cornelius, and Krista,
[00:50:52 - 00:51:00]	 John Dee, and Robert Sludge, and Elias Levy. They're all out there pulling for us.
[00:51:00 - 00:51:07]	 And every shaman and shamaness, every magician, practitioner, as far back in time as you go,
[00:51:07 - 00:51:16]	 was part of the plan, the conjuration, the great work, the distillation of the quintessence.
[00:51:16 - 00:51:25]	 History is a magical invocation, and at the end of that invocation, if it is correctly done,
[00:51:25 - 00:51:35]	 all boundaries will dissolve into the stone, the lapis, a transdimensional vehicle that can move through space and time.
[00:51:35 - 00:51:47]	 That is, the collectivity of all human souls, free at last, in what we call the divine imagination.
[00:51:47 - 00:51:51]	 And you don't have to wait for the general dispensation.
[00:51:51 - 00:52:03]	 You can join up anytime by hyperspatializing your metaphors and your point of view through psychedelic symbiosis
[00:52:03 - 00:52:13]	 with the plants that are pouring this hyperdimensional giant vision into the minds of anyone who will detoxify themselves
[00:52:13 - 00:52:24]	 from history and linear thinking and thus open themselves to the presence of the transformative mystery
[00:52:24 - 00:52:32]	 that is going to leave this planet unrecognizable to us within our lifetime.
[00:52:32 - 00:52:45]	 So that's the basic deal.
[00:52:45 - 00:52:48]	 And I think it raises a lot of questions, and Yuri's is first.
[00:52:48 - 00:52:55]	 Oh wait, is there a microphone or is that for thoughtfully anticipated?
[00:52:55 - 00:52:56]	 Just repeat it.
[00:52:56 - 00:52:57]	 I'll repeat it.
[00:52:57 - 00:53:05]	 Are there any northern hemisphere western herbs that would have this that we would have access to?
[00:53:05 - 00:53:09]	 The answer is yes, yes.
[00:53:09 - 00:53:10]	 Repeat the question.
[00:53:10 - 00:53:16]	 The question is are there herbs in the Capricorn that contain DMT?
[00:53:16 - 00:53:27]	 Yes, there are certain grasses, Polaris arundinaceus, Polaris tuberosa.
[00:53:27 - 00:53:35]	 These can be ordered from plant dealers or gotten, ironically enough, from Agricultural Experiment Station,
[00:53:35 - 00:53:40]	 because these are some pasturage grasses.
[00:53:40 - 00:53:50]	 A lot of people are doing wonderful work right now learning how to make DMT preparations out of native plants.
[00:53:50 - 00:53:57]	 The mature Polaris grass is very diffuse, the DMT.
[00:53:57 - 00:54:03]	 So what people are doing is they're getting the seeds and they're sprouting them in a sprouter,
[00:54:03 - 00:54:14]	 and then they're taking the sprouted seeds and air drying them, well, you can imagine how powdery sprouts become if you air dry them.
[00:54:14 - 00:54:20]	 Well, then you can powder up a handful of these sprouts and roll,
[00:54:20 - 00:54:26]	 and twist that into a bomb and come very, very close to the flash.
[00:54:26 - 00:54:33]	 The other thing, I mean, if I'm talking to recipe-oriented musicians,
[00:54:33 - 00:54:43]	 the other thing you need to understand if you want to work in this area is that the DMT can ordinarily not be taken orally
[00:54:43 - 00:54:53]	 because there is an enzyme system in your intestines called the monomaniacal database system, and it will destroy the DMT.
[00:54:53 - 00:55:01]	 But the good news is there are certain compounds called monoaminoxidase inhibitors.
[00:55:01 - 00:55:03]	 Didn't you know it?
[00:55:03 - 00:55:10]	 If you take a monoaminoxidase inhibitor and then you take DMT,
[00:55:10 - 00:55:16]	 the DMT will survive the gas and pass into the bloodstream and pass the blood-grain barrier.
[00:55:16 - 00:55:22]	 So here is a very important piece of practical information I'm about to give you.
[00:55:22 - 00:55:35]	 If you want to inhibit your monoaminoxidase in order to make DMT trips longer or mushroom trips longer and more intense,
[00:55:35 - 00:55:45]	 or to activate DMT if you only have a little bit of it, then what you should get are the seeds of megaminpharmula,
[00:55:45 - 00:55:53]	 T-E-R-G-A-M-U-M, pergaminpharmula, H-A-R-M-A-L-A.
[00:55:53 - 00:56:06]	 You can either order it under that name or go to an Arabian market and buy what is called hermal, H-U-R-M-A-L.
[00:56:06 - 00:56:09]	 This is simply pergaminpharmula seed.
[00:56:09 - 00:56:14]	 They use it as an incense to indicate room.
[00:56:14 - 00:56:29]	 Two grams, don't take more, two grams of this macerated in a mortar and pestle with spring water taken from a spring at the new moon
[00:56:29 - 00:56:39]	 near a crossroad will inhibit your MAO.
[00:56:39 - 00:56:48]	 It will inhibit your MAO. Consequently, then when you smoke the bomber of boleros, it will grab on.
[00:56:48 - 00:56:53]	 Or you can even smoke mushrooms then and they will grab on.
[00:56:53 - 00:57:03]	 So knowing how to inhibit MAO is one of the key techniques in this kind of herbal shamanic magic.
[00:57:03 - 00:57:12]	 Other plants that contain DMT, and here's one you all should be aware of because it's probably right around here,
[00:57:12 - 00:57:19]	 is Desmampus alinensis, Illinois bundle weed.
[00:57:19 - 00:57:30]	 It's a rank weed. I've not seen it except in the dried form, but people have grown hundreds of times of this stuff in a few months.
[00:57:30 - 00:57:37]	 And the root bark has the highest concentration of DMT ever measured in any plant.
[00:57:37 - 00:57:42]	 It's higher than the ayahuasca adenectures used in the Amazon, pardon?
[00:57:42 - 00:57:44]	 In the roots you said?
[00:57:44 - 00:57:53]	 In the root bark, the root bark, which you dry the root and then scrape the bark off and you'll get this reddish root bark.
[00:57:53 - 00:58:04]	 And this red is actually the DMT. Verona trees in the Amazon shed DMT in their sap, and it's always a blood red sap.
[00:58:04 - 00:58:09]	 And to show you how strong it is, the Indians in the Amazon, some of the tribes,
[00:58:09 - 00:58:20]	 they roll their arrow points directly into that sap and it's a paralytic poison in the bloodstream of monkeys and small animals.
[00:58:20 - 00:58:30]	 So there is a great deal of work is being done right now, and you should, if you're of an experimental and herbal and alchemical
[00:58:30 - 00:58:37]	 and magical bent, people are creating what they call ayahuasca amalong.
[00:58:37 - 00:58:47]	 This is where you use local plants to create a brew which is chemically equivalent to an Amazonian palisandrin.
[00:58:47 - 00:58:53]	 And of course you have the satisfaction that it's yours. It's your magical recipe.
[00:58:53 - 00:58:57]	 No one on earth is doing quite what you've got.
[00:58:57 - 00:59:05]	 And it's very, a lot of interesting work is being done, and you'll hear more about this.
[00:59:05 - 00:59:14]	 In fact, Jonathan Alasdair wrote a book called "Ayahuasca Analog" in which the state of the art is spelled out.
[00:59:14 - 00:59:19]	 And it would be worth your while to check that out if you're an experimentalist.
[00:59:19 - 00:59:34]	 Yeah.
[00:59:34 - 00:59:42]	 The question is, is there a more, is there a simple reagent test for the presence of DMT?
[00:59:42 - 00:59:44]	 The answer is sort of.
[00:59:44 - 00:59:56]	 You can do a paper chromatographic test, and all you need is a little UV light and some chromatography paper and some solvent dish.
[00:59:56 - 01:00:02]	 I mean, it's at the level of a seventh grade science project.
[01:00:02 - 01:00:05]	 Yes, I don't know how much I should say on this subject.
[01:00:05 - 01:00:08]	 I'm probably about to say too much.
[01:00:08 - 01:00:19]	 But at one gathering I go to, one of the people who's a very regular part of that particular policy is a wheat breeder.
[01:00:19 - 01:00:25]	 So, when he heard about the Polaris, he was a geneticist and a wheat breeder,
[01:00:25 - 01:00:33]	 and he has been working very quietly on his own to produce super strains of Polaris.
[01:00:33 - 01:00:42]	 And I think we will soon see super strains because the underground community is incredibly creative in this area.
[01:00:42 - 01:00:49]	 The compound I talked about yesterday, salvia, that's all underground work.
[01:00:49 - 01:00:54]	 Brad Bloster, the anthropologist who discovered this, is a complete freak.
[01:00:54 - 01:01:02]	 The guy, the chemist who extracted it who would prefer I don't put out his name is a complete freak.
[01:01:02 - 01:01:12]	 And the people who then did the confirmation studies, my brother and his band is performing pharmacology all around.
[01:01:12 - 01:01:17]	 So, we actually, we do not take ourselves seriously enough.
[01:01:17 - 01:01:20]	 I mean, we have our scientists.
[01:01:20 - 01:01:22]	 We have our philosophers.
[01:01:22 - 01:01:26]	 We have our thinkers, our legal experts.
[01:01:26 - 01:01:29]	 We are a complete community.
[01:01:29 - 01:01:37]	 And it's no longer in my mind even necessary to publish in straight journals and to seek a path of megas
[01:01:37 - 01:01:41]	 from the American pharmacology community.
[01:01:41 - 01:01:45]	 They don't understand what we think they're for anymore.
[01:01:45 - 01:01:54]	 About yesterday, you mentioned something of the jumbo and the base field of California,
[01:01:54 - 01:01:57]	 and I don't have the first part of that.
[01:01:57 - 01:02:04]	 Could you give out a name of the -- Yes, I'll repeat this and strengthen once again my case to the guy
[01:02:04 - 01:02:09]	 who owns the company that he should pay me.
[01:02:09 - 01:02:17]	 If you want a catalog of extremely rare and useful psychoactive and magical plants,
[01:02:17 - 01:02:25]	 probably the most complete in the world, the company is called Of the Jungle.
[01:02:25 - 01:02:38]	 PO Box 1801, the magical, S-E-D-A-S-T-O-P-O-L, California 95472.
[01:02:38 - 01:02:41]	 Write and ask for a catalog.
[01:02:41 - 01:02:45]	 And tell them George Bush sent you.
[01:02:45 - 01:02:47]	 Don't tell them that.
[01:02:47 - 01:02:51]	 They won't send you the catalog.
[01:02:51 - 01:02:55]	 1801 is the box number.
[01:02:55 - 01:02:59]	 Do you think the Irish have had a good run of the art of reading?
[01:02:59 - 01:03:01]	 I haven't.
[01:03:01 - 01:03:08]	 I have so much reading to do that I tend to restrict my reading to nonfiction.
[01:03:08 - 01:03:13]	 [
[01:03:14 - 01:03:23]	 inaudible ]
[01:03:24 - 01:03:29]	 [
[01:03:29 - 01:03:34]	 inaudible ]
[01:03:35 - 01:03:40]	 [
[01:03:40 - 01:03:45]	 inaudible ]
[01:03:59 - 01:04:04]	 Well, Lenny, I didn't mean to dis-accapinate it as a metaphor maker.
[01:04:04 - 01:04:09]	 No, I think The Teachings of Don Juan is a tremendous book.
[01:04:09 - 01:04:15]	 I am very suspicious of some of his later stuff.
[01:04:15 - 01:04:22]	 It's interesting what you said because you know the famous pro-transformation in The Teachings of Don Juan
[01:04:22 - 01:04:26]	 has been traced, and I'm sure many of you know this book,
[01:04:26 - 01:04:32]	 has been traced to George MacDonald's book Through the Gates of the Silver Key.
[01:04:32 - 01:04:38]	 And George MacDonald was a friend of Evan Vance.
[01:04:38 - 01:04:45]	 I think what we're getting here is a mining of late 19th century English folklore by Castaneda.
[01:04:45 - 01:04:54]	 Nevertheless, the presence of these small entities has been a part of the folklore for a long,
[01:04:54 - 01:04:58]	 long time, elemental types.
[01:04:58 - 01:05:06]	 What puzzled me about -- what puzzled me, I guess, is I spent a lot of time in this magical literature
[01:05:06 - 01:05:13]	 and art historical area, and the descriptions don't quite match.
[01:05:13 - 01:05:22]	 I can't quite convince myself that the Scythes, the Apfries, the Nixies, the Jinns,
[01:05:22 - 01:05:28]	 these creatures of the woodland fey are the same thing.
[01:05:28 - 01:05:37]	 Or I don't know whether I am contaminated by an early love of science fiction.
[01:05:37 - 01:05:41]	 Well, again, close, but no bananas.
[01:05:41 - 01:05:49]	 All these popular aliens that are running around, you know, the three boys and all these things,
[01:05:49 - 01:05:54]	 are much more mundane than what I encountered.
[01:05:54 - 01:06:02]	 And what I encountered was terrifyingly not human, terrifyingly alien.
[01:06:02 - 01:06:08]	 And I just do not quite get -- and I'll go back to see who's into it.
[01:06:08 - 01:06:10]	 They're always saying -- I don't know.
[01:06:10 - 01:06:13]	 They're very sort of cut and dried about it.
[01:06:13 - 01:06:19]	 And when I encounter an extraterrestrial alien or a creature from another dimension,
[01:06:19 - 01:06:24]	 the main thing that's happened for me is the implications is blowing my mind.
[01:06:24 - 01:06:25]	 They don't listen.
[01:06:25 - 01:06:32]	 They only listen to the implications.
[01:06:32 - 01:07:00]	 I'm wondering if you've seen the film "Tribe" that you made, "Somebody's Got a
[01:07:00 - 01:07:14]	 BMP is Smoked West of the Pacific Coast Highway," that it wouldn't surprise me if the writers of Star Trek were onto this.
[01:07:14 - 01:07:22]	 Yes, what is not much talked about, the part of the experience which is anomalous,
[01:07:22 - 01:07:27]	 and maybe people who know more about magical literature than I do can correct me,
[01:07:27 - 01:07:37]	 but what the elves are really interested in is this stuff which I call visible language.
[01:07:37 - 01:07:44]	 That's the whole point of the encounter is to exhibit it and to get you to do it.
[01:07:44 - 01:07:49]	 Well, now, first of all, think for a minute about ordinary language.
[01:07:49 - 01:07:52]	 It's really weird.
[01:07:52 - 01:07:55]	 It's the weirdest thing we do.
[01:07:55 - 01:08:05]	 I mean, if you were looking for the thumbprint of God on creation, human language would be a good candidate,
[01:08:05 - 01:08:11]	 because look, we're supposed to be some kind of animal who just went a little further than the next guy,
[01:08:11 - 01:08:22]	 but to get out of that Shakespeare and Milton is a pretty amazing atopic and hardly to speak of the mathematical languages of the Henry.
[01:08:22 - 01:08:25]	 So something happened.
[01:08:25 - 01:08:29]	 Some people think only 35,000 years ago.
[01:08:29 - 01:08:31]	 Imagine that's true.
[01:08:31 - 01:08:32]	 I mean, I don't care.
[01:08:32 - 01:08:39]	 Some people say 150,000 years ago, but to speak, to take small mouth noises
[01:08:39 - 01:08:45]	 and to turn them into signifiers for symbols and relationships,
[01:08:45 - 01:08:55]	 but in spite of some people's enthusiasm for the Tatians and dolphins, I just am not overwhelmed by the evidence.
[01:08:55 - 01:09:01]	 I mean, to me, you know, it is a miracle to be able to speak Polish.
[01:09:01 - 01:09:03]	 It is a miracle.
[01:09:03 - 01:09:10]	 I mean, when Coleridge wrote, "And south and south and southward I we fled,
[01:09:10 - 01:09:22]	 and it grew wondrous cold, and ice massed high, went floating by as green as emerald."
[01:09:22 - 01:09:34]	 I mean, that's language and it's magic, and we have a fascination, then we also paint, then we sculpt, then we write,
[01:09:34 - 01:09:38]	 then we create electronic databases, then film, television.
[01:09:38 - 01:09:48]	 Clearly, what we want to do is we want to communicate visually, and these things are saying there's a way to do it.
[01:09:48 - 01:09:49]	 Let's do it.
[01:09:49 - 01:09:50]	 And I don't understand.
[01:09:50 - 01:09:54]	 Do we all have to be loaded on DMT all the time?
[01:09:54 - 01:09:56]	 Can you learn to do this?
[01:09:56 - 01:10:05]	 The gentleman who asked about dreams, here's a piece of information that is critical in this jigsaw puzzle.
[01:10:05 - 01:10:15]	 If you have smoked DMT at any time in the past, it is possible to have a dream in which people are running around
[01:10:15 - 01:10:19]	 and you're checked into the Mars Hotel and the luggage is lost and this and that,
[01:10:19 - 01:10:26]	 and in the middle of all that someone drags out a little glass of pipe and hands it to you.
[01:10:26 - 01:10:28]	 It will happen.
[01:10:28 - 01:10:33]	 It will happen in the dream, not a memory, not a simulacrum.
[01:10:33 - 01:10:35]	 It will really happen.
[01:10:35 - 01:10:43]	 Well, now, to me, that's an amazing piece of data because what it's saying is you can do it on the match.
[01:10:43 - 01:10:49]	 You may have to be dead asleep, but still on the match it can be done.
[01:10:49 - 01:10:57]	 And the lucid dreamers, the biofeedback people, the people who claim these wonderful things that you can do with sleep
[01:10:57 - 01:11:05]	 and dream and programming, I challenge them, teach people to have DMT dreams in their sleep.
[01:11:05 - 01:11:13]	 And then let's figure out how to drag that puppy into the light so that we can do it at will on the match.
[01:11:13 - 01:11:15]	 Just one second.
[01:11:15 - 01:11:31]	 One thing that I have come to believe is that we need to remember no more than 5% of our dreams, and it's the most mundane 5%.
[01:11:31 - 01:11:39]	 I think, and there's scientific evidence to support this, remember I said DMT is in the human brain?
[01:11:39 - 01:11:51]	 It concentrates in the human cerebrospinal fluid on a 24-hour cycle, and it reaches its peak of concentration between 3 and 4 a.m. in most people.
[01:11:51 - 01:11:55]	 That's when the deep REM sleep is happening.
[01:11:55 - 01:12:08]	 When you give somebody DMT, they lay back, they close their eyes, and the way you, the guide, the sitter, I don't like the word guide, you the sitter,
[01:12:08 - 01:12:15]	 the way you can tell that they're getting off is their eyes dart wildly behind their closed eyelids.
[01:12:15 - 01:12:19]	 It means they're in REM, they're in REM sleep.
[01:12:19 - 01:12:22]	 They can immediately jump into deep dreaming.
[01:12:22 - 01:12:34]	 So I believe that what DMT is doing in normal human metabolism is it mediates the dispense, the spiral dispense into dreams,
[01:12:34 - 01:12:47]	 and that every single night we are reunited with the boundaryless oceanic mystery of being that we are so frantic about in waking life,
[01:12:47 - 01:12:59]	 so different from, and that if we could in fact just engineer a drug that would allow us to remain fully conscious as we drift deeper into dreams,
[01:12:59 - 01:13:07]	 we would need no other drug or substance, that that's where we want to go, and I think that's where history is headed.
[01:13:07 - 01:13:13]	 What the archaic revival is about is a re-visification of the aboriginal dream talk.
[01:13:13 - 01:13:17]	 We are going to live in the imagination.
[01:13:17 - 01:13:22]	 We are preparing to decant from three-dimensional space.
[01:13:22 - 01:13:34]	 I mean, yes, the Earth is the cradle of the human race, but you don't stay in the cradle forever, you know, and it's something like going into dreams.
[01:13:34 - 01:13:43]	 It's something like taking the hyper-technical virtual reality internet heads of the snake
[01:13:43 - 01:13:58]	 and inserting the demonic, late, paleolithic, ecstatic, orgiastic tale of the snake, and then you have your reward.
[01:13:58 - 01:14:05]	 Then you have the quintessence and the work is complete and history ends,
[01:14:05 - 01:14:13]	 and we live then in the light of the stone made manifest.
[01:14:13 - 01:14:14]	 Yes, yes.
[01:14:14 - 01:14:16]	 The question of my wedding is that...
[01:14:16 - 01:14:19]	 Wedding and its district. Then you.
[01:14:19 - 01:14:47]	 [inaudible]
[01:14:47 - 01:15:16]	 [inaudible]
[01:15:16 - 01:15:36]	 [inaudible]
[01:15:36 - 01:15:39]	 I understand what you're saying, but is there a question?
[01:15:39 - 01:15:43]	 [inaudible]
[01:15:43 - 01:15:57]	 So, it definitely has something, this mystery that we're talking about, it definitely has something to do with sound and the magical role of sound.
[01:15:57 - 01:16:13]	 Ayahuasca is a sort of different way of sectioning the DMT experience because ayahuasca is orally active, unfolds over hours, is not as dramatic as DMT,
[01:16:13 - 01:16:25]	 but the people who use ayahuasca as a ritual on a weekly basis, what their practice consists of is they take this stuff
[01:16:25 - 01:16:35]	 and then they sing, they sing like crazy, and then when they stop singing and people light a cigarette and take a leak and so forth,
[01:16:35 - 01:16:42]	 and you're listening to these conversations, you hear people say stuff about the shaman like,
[01:16:42 - 01:16:54]	 "I like the part with the olive drab and the silver, but when it became magenta and moved toward orange, I thought he was over the top."
[01:16:54 - 01:17:07]	 And what kind of criticism of the fall of magenta? And the answer is sound has become a visually beheld medium.
[01:17:07 - 01:17:13]	 It's like a new way of creating visual art that's interactive between the people who are on the DMT.
[01:17:13 - 01:17:22]	 Yes, so the reason I'm interested in something as techno-nerdy as virtual reality
[01:17:22 - 01:17:35]	 is because you could program a virtual reality so that when you went, aaaaah, an iridescent blue line would be keyed to that to descend into the space.
[01:17:35 - 01:17:47]	 And I'm very interested in environmental and electronic simulations of psychedelic states, but we're not going to do better than psychedelics.
[01:17:47 - 01:17:59]	 We can do as well as will be a miracle. You see more beauty in the first wave of psilocybin than the human race has produced in the past 5,000 years.
[01:17:59 - 01:18:13]	 And who are you? You know, I promised this guy, Benny, and I felt his splash of glow in the air.
[01:18:13 - 01:18:24]	 So, have you experienced, in 2012, the magenta point in your contract, might be due to the explicit shield point that will be a share of the time
[01:18:24 - 01:18:33]	 that it's going to break through to the beginning of Iowa and it's going to be a trend sequence that's going to start over again in the next 3 billion years?
[01:18:33 - 01:18:40]	 I haven't considered that, but that sounds possible. I mean, we're definitely coming to something enormous.
[01:18:40 - 01:18:49]	 And whether you think it's the cus, the cus, or just a big cus, it's hard to say. Somebody faxed me.
[01:18:49 - 01:18:57]	 I got a fax right before I came here. I don't know who sent it to me. It was just an anonymous fax, but in huge letters it said,
[01:18:57 - 01:19:03]	 "When you strip away the hype, it's just another contraction."
[01:19:03 - 01:19:12]	 I'm curious to know what the universality of your experience that you described is.
[01:19:12 - 01:19:19]	 And it's certainly a project of a people who have APD. We haven't shown them your experience.
[01:19:19 - 01:19:22]	 Are they reporting very, very close to the same thing?
[01:19:22 - 01:19:29]	 It's interesting, and that's a good question. The answer is yes and no.
[01:19:29 - 01:19:35]	 Obviously, there's hardly anything more personal than a psychedelic experience.
[01:19:35 - 01:19:43]	 It is that kind of summation of who you are, and it's viewed through the filters of your personality.
[01:19:43 - 01:19:53]	 Nevertheless, when you put a whole bunch of EMT tricks together, certain things seem to emerge.
[01:19:53 - 01:20:04]	 My notion, coming at it from a sort of William attitude, is if we had to say what is the archetype of EMT,
[01:20:04 - 01:20:12]	 the archetype is the circus. It's the circus, and let me say why.
[01:20:12 - 01:20:21]	 First of all, a circus is a place of wild, exotic activity, and it clowns.
[01:20:21 - 01:20:28]	 You don't have a circus without clowns, and clowns are wonderful for children.
[01:20:28 - 01:20:31]	 A circus is a wonderful place for a child.
[01:20:31 - 01:20:42]	 EMT, there is something very, very weirdly childlike about it in a very unchildish way.
[01:20:42 - 01:20:54]	 Some of you may know the 52nd fragment of Heraclitus, where he says the aeon is a child at play with colored balls.
[01:20:54 - 01:21:01]	 The aeon is the child that you encounter in the out dome.
[01:21:01 - 01:21:13]	 But the circus has other connotations, but simply the three rings and the clown. Eero is present,
[01:21:13 - 01:21:20]	 inclined with Thanatos, in the form of the nearly naked lady in the tiny,
[01:21:20 - 01:21:29]	 tangled costume who is working without nest, hanging by her teeth up near the top of the big tent.
[01:21:29 - 01:21:37]	 Personally, my earliest experience of Eero was that lady in the tiny, tangled costume.
[01:21:37 - 01:21:45]	 I was so small, I was wrapped up in something and being held, and I was horny as hell.
[01:21:45 - 01:21:55]	 So there's that, and then there is also radiating off from the central ring, the freak show, the ghost base boy,
[01:21:55 - 01:22:06]	 the lady in the bath hole, and the three-toed alligator kid, and all of that, that's there, the witty, weird, kinky,
[01:22:06 - 01:22:16]	 strange alien stuff. And then if you think about the archetype, not so much of the circus, but of the carnival,
[01:22:16 - 01:22:25]	 the carnival represents a breakthrough from another dimension, because you live in some jerk water town,
[01:22:25 - 01:22:36]	 and in some, I almost said Iowa, but it's like normal. And then the carnival comes to town,
[01:22:36 - 01:22:42]	 and children are told, you can't stay out and play, the carnival people are in town.
[01:22:42 - 01:22:51]	 And what does it mean? Well, they may fuck differently than we do, they may steal things, they're not like us,
[01:22:51 - 01:22:59]	 they've had more than one marriage, some of them. And then the carnival people are there, and the hoochie-coochie dancers
[01:22:59 - 01:23:05]	 and the whole thing, and then they fold it up and they go away, just like a DMV trick.
[01:23:05 - 01:23:13]	 And every little boy and girl in the world, worth their salt, wanted to join the circus, of course,
[01:23:13 - 01:23:20]	 and go away with the tattooed lady and the tigers and all that. So it is the archetype of the circus.
[01:23:20 - 01:23:29]	 So then I've seen many, many people take DMV, and some get what I get, which is sort of going beyond the circus.
[01:23:29 - 01:23:39]	 It's the circus that's presented on the Neville Genovese crime, or something like that.
[01:23:39 - 01:23:44]	 But one woman was an anthropologist who I think got a stuff threshold dose.
[01:23:44 - 01:23:51]	 She had a very interesting trip because it was a life trip, but with no talking from me.
[01:23:51 - 01:24:00]	 I was at a carnival midway, but it was after hours, and there was nobody there, and there were just those ice cream,
[01:24:00 - 01:24:08]	 those square papers for holding ice cream, blowing in the wind and getting caught in chain-link fences.
[01:24:08 - 01:24:15]	 It was like a stuff threshold dose. Well, then if she'd done more, she would have arrived there eight hours earlier.
[01:24:15 - 01:24:22]	 If she'd done yet another dose, it would have moved off into the zone of the truly weird.
[01:24:22 - 01:24:28]	 That's why I love the film of Federico Fellini, because here was a circus.
[01:24:28 - 01:24:49]	 [Unintelligible]
[01:24:49 - 01:24:57]	 I don't want to tell you to do it nasally because it might be a really stinging experience.
[01:24:57 - 01:25:05]	 Well, then you could do it. I'm working on something. I'll describe it to you.
[01:25:05 - 01:25:12]	 I'm having a glass blower make a thing which has a chamber with a pipe stem coming off it,
[01:25:12 - 01:25:21]	 but it has another stem 180 degrees around the chamber coming off it that breaks into two prongs.
[01:25:21 - 01:25:32]	 And what you do is you use the DMT, you insert the two prongs up your nose, and you have a grand blow on the other outlet,
[01:25:32 - 01:25:39]	 and it will force the entire contents of the vessel, the entire load of white smoke.
[01:25:39 - 01:25:44]	 But, you know, don't try this at home.
[01:25:44 - 01:25:49]	 Pardon me?
[01:25:49 - 01:25:57]	 I don't like the first time I've found it. You know, there are old pharmacologists and bold pharmacologists,
[01:25:57 - 01:26:03]	 but there are no old, bold pharmacologists.
[01:26:03 - 01:26:09]	 Give it to me.
[01:26:09 - 01:26:13]	 There are anti-depressants that are MAO inhibitors. That's right.
[01:26:13 - 01:26:21]	 But I wouldn't use them for this purpose because what you want is what's called a reversible MAO inhibitor.
[01:26:21 - 01:26:32]	 And carmeline, which is in the Syrian rue, is a reversible MAO inhibitor, reversible in four to six hours.
[01:26:32 - 01:26:40]	 Some of these anti-depressants inhibit every molecule of MAO in your body for up to three weeks.
[01:26:40 - 01:26:47]	 And that's why when they give you those anti-depressants, they tell you the long list that don't, you know, no chocolate,
[01:26:47 - 01:26:55]	 no red wine, no soft cheese, no lentils, no this. That's a list of alkaloids containing food.
[01:26:55 - 01:27:04]	 And if you are on those MAO inhibitors inhibiting anti-depressants and you eat a bunch of camomile with your yucky friends,
[01:27:04 - 01:27:13]	 you'll probably have to be roped down for a while before you straighten out.
[01:27:13 - 01:27:23]	 How does DMT experience compare to those you've had on what substances which might be familiar to some of us like psychedelic mushrooms and LSD?
[01:27:23 - 01:27:30]	 He said, how does DMT compare to more familiar psychedelics like mushrooms and LSD?
[01:27:30 - 01:27:38]	 The thing is, let me say this about mushrooms. I mean, I really -- mushrooms are my thing.
[01:27:38 - 01:27:45]	 I mean, they enlighten me, they straighten me out, they love me.
[01:27:45 - 01:28:04]	 But the way to do mushrooms is the very first move if you're interested in mushrooms is for God's sake buy a scale, buy a signal.
[01:28:04 - 01:28:13]	 I mean, you wouldn't think that this would be considered such an exotic suggestion to people who are going to put their bodies and minds on the line
[01:28:13 - 01:28:20]	 because people don't take the mushrooms. People do not take the mushrooms.
[01:28:20 - 01:28:25]	 They take this amount and then they claim that they're an issue.
[01:28:25 - 01:28:37]	 You can take a measured five-gram on an empty stomach, measured, and then you see what that is,
[01:28:37 - 01:28:45]	 and you'll realize that you weren't even camped in the atrium, you were camped in the driveway.
[01:28:45 - 01:28:58]	 And mushrooms to my -- in some ways, I mean, DMT is the most terrifying and astonishing thing in the universe,
[01:28:58 - 01:29:03]	 but it's very hard to know what to do with it.
[01:29:03 - 01:29:09]	 Philocybin is your friend. It wants to teach.
[01:29:09 - 01:29:20]	 It will take you by the hand and forgive you and lead you and be with you, and it speaks.
[01:29:20 - 01:29:29]	 This is the amazing thing, and you're hearing this from somebody who graduated from Heidegger and F.H. Bradley.
[01:29:29 - 01:29:34]	 It speaks. No other psychedelic does that in my experience.
[01:29:34 - 01:29:43]	 Occasionally a phrase will pop into your head on another substance that is like a gift, an act of love,
[01:29:43 - 01:29:51]	 but I mean, Philocybin raves. It raves, and it has position.
[01:29:51 - 01:30:01]	 You may not like Philocybin as a person because it is not -- the astonishing thing about the Philocybin entity,
[01:30:01 - 01:30:07]	 to my mind, and I get good confirmation of this, is it is not very earthly.
[01:30:07 - 01:30:15]	 I mean, it wants to show you machines the size of Manhattan in orbit around alien stars.
[01:30:15 - 01:30:23]	 It wants to talk about the sweep through of the Zona which happened before the Earth cooled,
[01:30:23 - 01:30:30]	 and it has seen the empires of the roll out of the rim and all the rest of it.
[01:30:30 - 01:30:39]	 And it's very puzzling, this cosmic, galactarian tone, because then you switch over to ayahuasca,
[01:30:39 - 01:30:47]	 which is literally just a twist of the molecule, just plainly a sweeping of the molecule,
[01:30:47 - 01:30:58]	 and suddenly it's about childbirth, rivers, the land, the feminine, looking inside your body,
[01:30:58 - 01:31:04]	 curing diseases, feeling, telepathy, communication.
[01:31:04 - 01:31:12]	 It could hardly be more different, and yet chemically these things are like two sides of the same coin.
[01:31:12 - 01:31:23]	 So just to sum this up and put a kind of a classifier on it, I am not very interested in drugs per se.
[01:31:23 - 01:31:34]	 I've done a lot of the bad ones, good ones, and people do drugs for fun and for stupid reasons.
[01:31:34 - 01:31:44]	 But there is this tiny, tiny family, the tryptamine allicinogen, psilocybin, and EMT,
[01:31:44 - 01:31:49]	 and then some artificial coaching and five of the thought seeds on there.
[01:31:49 - 01:31:57]	 But this is the doorway, is the umbilicus of this world.
[01:31:57 - 01:32:06]	 These are things which are called drugs, because that's the category we have for things which make the world unrecognizable.
[01:32:06 - 01:32:08]	 But these are not drugs.
[01:32:08 - 01:32:20]	 They are magical doorways into staggeringly titanic dimensions of gnosis, power, information, understanding,
[01:32:20 - 01:32:25]	 and dimensions filled with affection for humanity.
[01:32:25 - 01:32:29]	 So I think people say, well, you think drugs should be legalized.
[01:32:29 - 01:32:35]	 Yeah, but that's the political opinion of Karen Contenna, who's just a guy like you.
[01:32:35 - 01:32:45]	 But this stuff about the tryptamines is a real discovery, and you can think what you like about me and my take on it.
[01:32:45 - 01:32:50]	 In fact, please do, but check it out.
[01:32:50 - 01:32:58]	 Check it out, because I've checked out lots of stuff, and this is the only thing I'm interested in telling you.
[01:32:58 - 01:33:01]	 Check it out.
[01:33:01 - 01:33:06]	 Yeah?
[01:33:06 - 01:33:22]	 [inaudible]
[01:33:22 - 01:33:26]	 No, I don't understand that, the answer to that question.
[01:33:26 - 01:33:33]	 It's magical. It is a secret which keeps itself.
[01:33:33 - 01:33:40]	 I mean, here I am. There are 200 people here, whatever, and I do this all the time,
[01:33:40 - 01:33:45]	 and I have not, so far as I can tell, been able to launch an avalanche of DMT.
[01:33:45 - 01:33:50]	 I'm trying to get drug experiences.
[01:33:50 - 01:33:52]	 I've had some amount of success with it.
[01:33:52 - 01:33:57]	 Anybody who's done DMT would want to try it. I can run you through the technique.
[01:33:57 - 01:33:58]	 Have you done DMT?
[01:33:58 - 01:33:59]	 No.
[01:33:59 - 01:34:07]	 I'd be interested. I'm very, I mean, I urge you to do it, but I'm very skeptical.
[01:34:07 - 01:34:13]	 And my machine, too, I've done them all, and it's not ten minutes of it, and you're blinded.
[01:34:13 - 01:34:16]	 And you're like, "God, I wish it was my big John."
[01:34:16 - 01:34:40]	 [laughter]
[01:34:40 - 01:35:03]	 [inaudible]
[01:35:03 - 01:35:05]	 Sure it is.
[01:35:05 - 01:35:24]	 [inaudible]
[01:35:24 - 01:35:26]	 That's a great idea.
[01:35:26 - 01:35:37]	 [inaudible]
[01:35:37 - 01:35:38]	 Yeah.
[01:35:38 - 01:35:41]	 [inaudible]
[01:35:41 - 01:35:44]	 And make a picture of this exactly.
[01:35:44 - 01:35:58]	 [inaudible]
[01:35:58 - 01:36:00]	 See this lady.
[01:36:00 - 01:36:12]	 [inaudible]
[01:36:12 - 01:36:17]	 Well, but this is against the law thing. Let me talk a minute about that.
[01:36:17 - 01:36:27]	 How can it be against the law if you have it in every brain walking around?
[01:36:27 - 01:36:31]	 No, I just mean logistically if you want to sell it to the nail, you're putting yourself at great legal risk.
[01:36:31 - 01:36:33]	 You're putting yourself at great legal risk.
[01:36:33 - 01:36:46]	 However, see, things like psilocybin and DMT, the reason they're illegal is because there was panning in California in '66.
[01:36:46 - 01:36:56]	 The California Assembly ran through your anti-drug law, and all these things were named,
[01:36:56 - 01:37:03]	 but no medical or scientific data was offered to show there was anything wrong with them.
[01:37:03 - 01:37:08]	 Basically, they were guilty as charged because they caused hallucinations.
[01:37:08 - 01:37:17]	 Well, then about three months later, the state of the country decided there needed to be a federal anti-Halifemian law,
[01:37:17 - 01:37:24]	 and they simply imported the California statute directly into federal law.
[01:37:24 - 01:37:32]	 So, it is conceivable that if one had enough money and takes a lot of money, you could beat the --
[01:37:32 - 01:37:37]	 you could force the reexamination of the drug laws by simply saying,
[01:37:37 - 01:37:42]	 number one, there is no scientific evidence that there's anything wrong with DMT.
[01:37:42 - 01:37:48]	 Number two, there's plenty of scientific evidence that DMT occurs normally in human metabolism,
[01:37:48 - 01:37:54]	 and how, therefore, can it be kept illegal, but it takes legal risk.
[01:37:54 - 01:38:05]	 Unless the plant is specifically named, but the Attorney General, at his own discretion,
[01:38:05 - 01:38:10]	 can add those plants to the schedule list without asking anything.
[01:38:10 - 01:38:30]	 Yes.
[01:38:30 - 01:38:37]	 No, well, it can't be law-making, I mean, if you have DMT, you can sell them out.
[01:38:37 - 01:38:45]	 You don't get any repeat customers, because if you sell somebody a gram, that's plenty his.
[01:38:45 - 01:38:52]	 Most people, they're half of it is size for their great-grandchildren.
[01:38:52 - 01:38:59]	 This is not a drug of abuse. Let me point that out to you.
[01:38:59 - 01:39:05]	 It's sort of a drug of anti-abuse. I know people who say, well, you have to book your favorite drug.
[01:39:05 - 01:39:10]	 Oh, DMT, I love it, love it. Well, when did you do it last, though?
[01:39:10 - 01:39:13]	 I mean, it was a year ago.
[01:39:13 - 01:39:24]	 Still processing, yes.
[01:39:24 - 01:39:27]	 Yo-hem-bay, is that what you asked about?
[01:39:27 - 01:39:31]	 I'm not sure that yo-hem-bay is in your mail, and hither.
[01:39:31 - 01:39:35]	 You should look it up in the Merck manual, and that's always does.
[01:39:35 - 01:39:39]	 There are many things which are weak MAO inhibitors.
[01:39:39 - 01:39:44]	 The easiest source for an MAO inhibitor, though, is the Pagana and Harmelin.
[01:39:44 - 01:39:49]	 And also, there is a plant in North America -- oh, no, I'm sorry.
[01:39:49 - 01:39:51]	 It also is Pagana and Harmelin.
[01:39:51 - 01:40:03]	 Pagana and Harmelin grows over vast areas of New Mexico, Nevada, and it yields a bright yellow dye,
[01:40:03 - 01:40:09]	 which is actually the harvane itself. It's the dye.
[01:40:09 - 01:40:10]	 Yeah.
[01:40:10 - 01:40:17]	 As one would suppose somehow, more than two decades of all kinds of people using it.
[01:40:17 - 01:40:27]	 And it felt good for me personally, it was a issue that I had to clean up.
[01:40:27 - 01:40:38]	 I heard nobody's very much -- and you have not brought up the possibility of any way of disturbing it.
[01:40:38 - 01:40:40]	 I would like to hear your views on it.
[01:40:40 - 01:40:51]	 Well, we should certainly talk about casualties and dangers. Addiction doesn't really figure in here in the ordinary sense
[01:40:51 - 01:40:57]	 of like opiate and nicotine addiction.
[01:40:57 - 01:41:08]	 You know, cannabis is the most addicting of these minor and near psychedelic, and it's only psychologically addicting.
[01:41:08 - 01:41:19]	 I mean, I found this out because a couple of years ago I actually quit for two months after not drawing an unsowned graph for 25 years.
[01:41:19 - 01:41:28]	 And all that happened was that I read more, and it's not clear that that's my problem.
[01:41:28 - 01:41:38]	 So, but danger we need to talk about, and that brings up the question, how should one do these things?
[01:41:38 - 01:41:48]	 How can you do it and gain maximum benefit and minimum wear and tear on your psyche and your body?
[01:41:48 - 01:41:55]	 The first thing is inform yourself. Inform yourself.
[01:41:55 - 01:42:06]	 The first stop on the psychedelic trip is the library. There are very, very deep books on these subjects, on the anthropology,
[01:42:06 - 01:42:15]	 the pharmacology, the psychology, the quantum mechanics of drug activity. Inform yourself.
[01:42:15 - 01:42:23]	 And then it's not about taking every drug in the book and, you know, people reel them off.
[01:42:23 - 01:42:30]	 They go, well, I did junk, I did this, I did that. It's no point. You don't get points for that.
[01:42:30 - 01:42:37]	 What you have to do is, and here's the piece, right out of Fascinatio, you have to find your ally.
[01:42:37 - 01:42:45]	 You have to find what works for you. And if you think that you're out of debt or a plan and you have a horrible experience,
[01:42:45 - 01:42:49]	 you don't really need to go back and back.
[01:42:49 - 01:42:58]	 The other thing is danger lies in the direction of combination.
[01:42:58 - 01:43:02]	 These are called synergies by pharmacologists.
[01:43:02 - 01:43:13]	 And if your idea of a big evening is to, you know, shoot 100 milliliters of ketamine and then drop some MDMA
[01:43:13 - 01:43:23]	 and a little Juicy B an hour later and then bring on some acid of undetermined prominence and so forth,
[01:43:23 - 01:43:27]	 100 milliliters of that, and I said, well, how was it?
[01:43:27 - 01:43:30]	 They said, hey, you're a far cryer.
[01:43:30 - 01:43:36]	 But the point is, this can never be reproduced, and these things are very dangerous.
[01:43:36 - 01:43:39]	 They synthesize you in an unexpected way.
[01:43:39 - 01:43:43]	 And my God, it's still a five and a DMT has never been studied.
[01:43:43 - 01:43:51]	 Do you think their relationship to Romilar and Nardil has been looked at very carefully?
[01:43:51 - 01:43:53]	 I don't think so.
[01:43:53 - 01:43:55]	 Then how to take it?
[01:43:55 - 01:44:00]	 And I represent a faction on that.
[01:44:00 - 01:44:11]	 I believe that you should take it with a little company as you can stand, basically.
[01:44:11 - 01:44:15]	 A lot of people like group work.
[01:44:15 - 01:44:20]	 I don't, but then I don't like groups generally.
[01:44:20 - 01:44:29]	 I mean, I'm basically a loner, and if I take psychedelics with somebody, I worry.
[01:44:29 - 01:44:37]	 I worry about them, and it keeps me on the surface.
[01:44:37 - 01:44:45]	 And I've had many psychedelic experiences where in the middle of it, it just passed through my mind,
[01:44:45 - 01:44:53]	 gee, I'm sure glad nobody is here to see this because I'm sure it would alarm them,
[01:44:53 - 01:44:57]	 and then we have a crisis.
[01:44:57 - 01:45:06]	 So my style, I mean, I'll take anything, if they speak in a low voice and hang out,
[01:45:06 - 01:45:08]	 if something interesting is going on.
[01:45:08 - 01:45:17]	 But the serious stuff goes on in darkness, in silence, and that's people go through the roof.
[01:45:17 - 01:45:19]	 They mean you don't even listen to music.
[01:45:19 - 01:45:20]	 That's right.
[01:45:20 - 01:45:28]	 In darkness, in silence, in a comfortable state, and that may mean in your apartment in Manhattan,
[01:45:28 - 01:45:33]	 or it may mean up a tree in Yosemite, whatever your thing is.
[01:45:33 - 01:45:39]	 And then I always use cannabis.
[01:45:39 - 01:45:45]	 Cannabis is your navigation tool, your reality check, your everything.
[01:45:45 - 01:45:53]	 I roll up the bombers, and I lay them out in front of me, and I have my mojo bag and a few things like that.
[01:45:53 - 01:46:00]	 From the moment I take it, I'm in sacral space.
[01:46:00 - 01:46:04]	 And this isn't even a rule followed in the Amazon.
[01:46:04 - 01:46:06]	 I mean, it totally blew my mind.
[01:46:06 - 01:46:11]	 In some ayahuasca circles, people would sit around talking and talking.
[01:46:11 - 01:46:13]	 Then everybody would take ayahuasca.
[01:46:13 - 01:46:16]	 There would be a sacral ceremonial moment.
[01:46:16 - 01:46:18]	 Everybody would take the ayahuasca.
[01:46:18 - 01:46:23]	 And then yak, yak, yak, and motorcycle parts saying, "What are the men here up to?"
[01:46:23 - 01:46:25]	 And everyone would go yak, yak, yak.
[01:46:25 - 01:46:30]	 And then at 30 minutes, all in the dark, the shaman would begin to whistle.
[01:46:30 - 01:46:36]	 Everybody would shut up, and within a minute, we'd be gone.
[01:46:36 - 01:46:44]	 The way I like to do it, and this is a good Catholic method for those who are recovering Catholics,
[01:46:44 - 01:46:57]	 I take it, and then I sit in my space, and I carry out what in Catechism class we were taught was called an examination of conscience.
[01:46:57 - 01:47:04]	 This is where you think about all the ways you've screwed up and all the people you've screwed over,
[01:47:04 - 01:47:09]	 and you basically anticipate a bad trip, what it is.
[01:47:09 - 01:47:17]	 You work -- what is the worst thing that could happen to me on this trip based on my current state of my psyche
[01:47:17 - 01:47:20]	 and my relationships with other people?
[01:47:20 - 01:47:27]	 Well, by the time this stuff actually begins to work, you don't.
[01:47:27 - 01:47:35]	 And, you know, some people say they take mushrooms, and within 20 minutes, we were tripping hard, tripping hard.
[01:47:35 - 01:47:38]	 I don't understand what that's about.
[01:47:38 - 01:47:42]	 It takes an hour and 20 minutes on the dot.
[01:47:42 - 01:47:43]	 It always has.
[01:47:43 - 01:47:46]	 I don't expect it to ever come faster.
[01:47:46 - 01:47:56]	 And I get into a kind of a zone where it's like it's nibbling at the edges, and it's not quite manifest.
[01:47:56 - 01:48:02]	 And then I smoke the first bomber, and usually that brings it in.
[01:48:02 - 01:48:04]	 That brings it in.
[01:48:04 - 01:48:07]	 And I also -- I speak to it.
[01:48:07 - 01:48:08]	 I speak to it.
[01:48:08 - 01:48:21]	 I invoke it, I propose, and in my own way, I don't know if it will tap gardenerian mustard, but I say to it, I say, show yourself.
[01:48:21 - 01:48:24]	 Show yourself.
[01:48:24 - 01:48:28]	 And it's very -- at that point, it's very erotic.
[01:48:28 - 01:48:33]	 It's like a veil dance is what it is.
[01:48:33 - 01:48:36]	 It is a veil dance.
[01:48:36 - 01:48:43]	 The girlfriend in the other dimension, the mushroom, once I said to it, to her, I don't know,
[01:48:43 - 01:48:46]	 but once I said to her, I said, what should I call you?
[01:48:46 - 01:48:49]	 And she said, call me Dorsey.
[01:48:49 - 01:48:53]	 [laughter]
[01:48:53 - 01:48:56]	 So I invoke it, and it comes.
[01:48:56 - 01:48:57]	 It comes.
[01:48:57 - 01:49:00]	 And then we're off.
[01:49:00 - 01:49:05]	 And sometimes it's easy and loving, and sometimes it's different.
[01:49:05 - 01:49:17]	 I remember one very festive trip I had where I had tossed out a big palm-towel pile from growing mushrooms years ago in another country.
[01:49:17 - 01:49:20]	 Actually, it was the past life I'm now recalling.
[01:49:20 - 01:49:27]	 But anyway, I tossed out the stuff, and this thing grew this humongous mushroom.
[01:49:27 - 01:49:31]	 And I had taken mushrooms the previous Saturday.
[01:49:31 - 01:49:35]	 I had taken a full dope, which was five dried grams.
[01:49:35 - 01:49:43]	 So I thought, I want to take mushrooms again this Saturday, but I think I may have picked up a tolerance.
[01:49:43 - 01:49:47]	 So I'll just take nine grams with this.
[01:49:47 - 01:49:50]	 And this is where the learning takes place.
[01:49:50 - 01:49:55]	 Treasure your mistakes.
[01:49:55 - 01:50:03]	 So the thing is, like, I'm sitting there, and suddenly I realize, oh, my God, it's coming at me.
[01:50:03 - 01:50:05]	 It's 100 miles wide.
[01:50:05 - 01:50:08]	 It's 10 miles high.
[01:50:08 - 01:50:11]	 And it's just rolling toward me.
[01:50:11 - 01:50:15]	 And I barely have time to lay down.
[01:50:15 - 01:50:22]	 And I'm not talking, and a voice says, prepare, the storm is about to hit the beach.
[01:50:22 - 01:50:28]	 And I lay down, and it was just like a tornado hitting.
[01:50:28 - 01:50:38]	 And at one point I opened my eyes, and there was this woman in a full bondage.
[01:50:38 - 01:50:45]	 She was just, you know, pierced things and rubber panties and the whole thing.
[01:50:45 - 01:50:49]	 And I was lying there between her legs.
[01:50:49 - 01:50:56]	 She was standing upright, and she put her face right down there to mine, and she said,
[01:50:56 - 01:51:06]	 "Is it strong enough for you, asshole?"
[01:51:06 - 01:51:10]	 To which I replied, "Yes."
[01:51:10 - 01:51:20]	 And then she said, "They say it helps to close your eyes, cowboy."
[01:51:20 - 01:51:27]	 And I later, thinking about that trip, I realized the reason the goddess,
[01:51:27 - 01:51:33]	 the reason the mushroom addressed me as cowboy is because that's --
[01:51:33 - 01:51:38]	 most people mushrooms have met have been cowboys and cowgirls,
[01:51:38 - 01:51:41]	 because they're the people who follow the cows.
[01:51:41 - 01:51:45]	 And most people have encountered this thing in the past.
[01:51:45 - 01:51:52]	 You know, Maria Sabina, the mushroom shamaness of Oaxaca, claimed not to have been initiated.
[01:51:52 - 01:51:56]	 She claimed that as a child left to watch the sheep and the cows,
[01:51:56 - 01:52:02]	 she had been hungry and had gotten into eating mushrooms.
[01:52:02 - 01:52:05]	 So, and I haven't lost my crib.
[01:52:05 - 01:52:07]	 This is the safety course.
[01:52:07 - 01:52:09]	 I haven't forgotten that.
[01:52:09 - 01:52:16]	 Once you get launched out in there, then there are tricks for navigation.
[01:52:16 - 01:52:24]	 And the two tricks that are indispensable, number one, I've already told you, have canopies ready,
[01:52:24 - 01:52:28]	 because if you get into a place that you don't like,
[01:52:28 - 01:52:34]	 you can jet out of there by just taking a poke or two.
[01:52:34 - 01:52:40]	 The other thing is, if you get into a place you don't like, chant.
[01:52:40 - 01:52:48]	 Don't do what most ponkeys do, which is crunch in the field, because you say,
[01:52:48 - 01:52:53]	 "I was fighting the sandbags. How many hours of this crunch?"
[01:52:53 - 01:52:58]	 Instead, take a breath and belt it out.
[01:52:58 - 01:53:01]	 Drowning into it.
[01:53:01 - 01:53:05]	 Drowning into it, but I really think it's important to oxygenate your body.
[01:53:05 - 01:53:10]	 It's very important to move the breath through.
[01:53:10 - 01:53:12]	 And there are hard places.
[01:53:12 - 01:53:18]	 If there weren't hard places, people wouldn't be so terrified of this stuff.
[01:53:18 - 01:53:22]	 So, when you get to a hard place, first of all,
[01:53:22 - 01:53:24]	 don't be an idiot.
[01:53:24 - 01:53:30]	 Don't abandon yourself to fear just because somebody puts something ugly in front of you.
[01:53:30 - 01:53:37]	 People put something ugly in front of you every day, and all you say is, "Yuck."
[01:53:37 - 01:53:39]	 So, do also work there.
[01:53:39 - 01:53:45]	 There are strange places, and we each have our own private hills.
[01:53:45 - 01:53:54]	 There's a place I go to nearly on every Iowasca trip that I call the meat blocker, and, you know, the less said about it,
[01:53:54 - 01:54:04]	 the more I feel like we're actually trying to fire up a little Santa Mia here.
[01:54:04 - 01:54:11]	 You know, same with the no meat blockers.
[01:54:11 - 01:54:16]	 Fast, I don't call it fasting, I just don't eat for six hours.
[01:54:16 - 01:54:28]	 Empty your stomach, and then the other thing is --
[01:54:28 - 01:54:32]	 You should -- your stomach should be empty.
[01:54:32 - 01:54:39]	 Well, throughout, and then at the end of the -- the way I do it is I usually start about eight at night.
[01:54:39 - 01:54:46]	 I'm alone always, and I go until one, and by one, it's over.
[01:54:46 - 01:54:50]	 And then what I do is I eat a bowl of granola or something like that.
[01:54:50 - 01:54:53]	 Don't sleep on an empty stomach.
[01:54:53 - 01:55:01]	 Don't, because then you'll wake up the next morning raw and rocky, and it's not that the mushroom did that.
[01:55:01 - 01:55:05]	 It's that you slept with a protein -- with a protein dip.
[01:55:05 - 01:55:13]	 So then eat your favorite food, and at the end is the tree.
[01:55:13 - 01:55:19]	 [inaudible]
[01:55:19 - 01:55:22]	 MDMA is a cyclotized amphetamine.
[01:55:22 - 01:55:28]	 It's a -- and what are called antacid.
[01:55:28 - 01:55:35]	 They're drugs which encourage exchange of feelings and that sort of thing.
[01:55:35 - 01:55:44]	 Under rare circumstances, you can squeeze a kind of wobbling hallucination out of it, but it's not --
[01:55:44 - 01:55:47]	 its purpose, I think, is different.
[01:55:47 - 01:55:54]	 It's for sorting out relationships, assisted psychotherapy, and having a good time.
[01:55:54 - 01:56:05]	 But it would be crazy to take MDMA as a hallucinogen because it's like entering a bicycle in a Ferrari race, you know.
[01:56:05 - 01:56:08]	 They're just much superior.
[01:56:08 - 01:56:14]	 And let me say about this, I mean, everything is my personal bias here.
[01:56:14 - 01:56:24]	 A lot of people have said, "You're a hallucination nut. You're obsessed with hallucination."
[01:56:24 - 01:56:27]	 I freely admit it.
[01:56:27 - 01:56:34]	 The reason I was underwhelmed by LSD, I mean, I liked it, and it was certainly engaging,
[01:56:34 - 01:56:38]	 but I could never hallucinate the way I wanted to.
[01:56:38 - 01:56:51]	 I read Havelock Ellis. I wanted to see, you know, the phosphorescent palaces, the naked maidens, the silk brocades, the alien world, vision.
[01:56:51 - 01:57:01]	 And LSD, these plots about things, funny ideas, strange things, hard to get vision until you smoke black Bombay hash.
[01:57:01 - 01:57:03]	 I should have talked about the shit.
[01:57:03 - 01:57:09]	 That worked. But I will defend my obsession with vision.
[01:57:09 - 01:57:12]	 I think the world wants to be seen.
[01:57:12 - 01:57:18]	 I think Blake was right that the divine imagination in something beheld.
[01:57:18 - 01:57:26]	 And for me, the visions are the proof that this is not my mind.
[01:57:26 - 01:57:32]	 And the visions are the proof that this is not simply chemical chaos and the nervous system.
[01:57:32 - 01:57:38]	 I mean, how could chemical chaos give you something as breathtakingly beautiful
[01:57:38 - 01:57:43]	 and as ordered as the Sistine Chapel or the World Trade Center?
[01:57:43 - 01:57:49]	 The hallucinations are extraordinarily ordered and beautiful.
[01:57:49 - 01:57:56]	 And I think that this is the proof that we are reaching beyond the confines of the human personality
[01:57:56 - 01:58:02]	 and even the human species that this information, don't ask me how,
[01:58:02 - 01:58:07]	 is somehow holographically deployed throughout space.
[01:58:07 - 01:58:10]	 And you tune it in. You tune it in.
[01:58:10 - 01:58:14]	 And so I care about visions.
[01:58:14 - 01:58:21]	 And if a drug doesn't cause vision, I tend to put it lower on my list.
[01:58:21 - 01:58:31]	 I smoke a lot of cannabis. I think. That's why I do cannabis. I just think on it.
[01:58:31 - 01:58:35]	 And I think several hours a day when I'm able to.
[01:58:35 - 01:58:46]	 But the visual thing is for me to be in the presence of the ministry is to be in the presence of the hallucination.
[01:58:46 - 01:58:52]	 And to me the word hallucination has no connotation of illusion.
[01:58:52 - 01:58:59]	 It comes from a Greek root, and what it means is to wander in the mind.
[01:58:59 - 01:59:04]	 That's what hallucination is, is the wandering in the mind.
[01:59:04 - 01:59:05]	 Yeah.
[01:59:05 - 01:59:11]	 Is it true that the doses of LSD you took that you didn't have hallucinations?
[01:59:11 - 01:59:18]	 Well, I took all kinds of doses. What dose of LSD did I take? I should be clear what I mean.
[01:59:18 - 01:59:30]	 I mean, you get LSD, even if I don't, but the little things that look like open fans that are going meep, meep, meep, meep, meep,
[01:59:30 - 01:59:32]	 like wallpaper.
[01:59:32 - 01:59:42]	 But LSD never gave me these sort of potentials. It lacked meaning.
[01:59:42 - 01:59:51]	 I couldn't just. The LSD hallucinations looked to me like I was living in the off-synchner, not in the fog.
[01:59:51 - 01:59:58]	 They were more like ripples and concentric circles and flashes of light.
[01:59:58 - 02:00:17]	 And what we see in hallucinations are cities, spaces, palaces, machines, the stuff of cognitive process that is most expressive.
[02:00:17 - 02:00:19]	 Okay. Yeah.
[02:00:19 - 02:00:27]	 Is it theoretically possible to develop your consciousness level to the point that you can go there without the drug?
[02:00:27 - 02:00:33]	 I grant the possibility, but in my heart of hearts I don't think so.
[02:00:33 - 02:00:37]	 The question is can you get there on the match?
[02:00:37 - 02:00:47]	 I get lots of resistance because I'm willing to say just flat out, no, no.
[02:00:47 - 02:00:58]	 You know, people are shocked that yoga and flagellation and being touched by Boba G and whatever.
[02:00:58 - 02:01:01]	 I don't know. I tried it all.
[02:01:01 - 02:01:08]	 And the other thing is what I'm talking about, you wouldn't want to have them on the match.
[02:01:08 - 02:01:12]	 These are states of serious discombobulation.
[02:01:12 - 02:01:16]	 These are not mood shifts or attitudes we're talking about.
[02:01:16 - 02:01:24]	 I mean, if I woke up and I could do it on the match, my first phone call would be to my friend Ralph Metzner, who's a shrink,
[02:01:24 - 02:01:32]	 and I could drowse and we've got a problem here.
[02:01:32 - 02:01:36]	 I -- if I may, and again, I'm a deaf here.
[02:01:36 - 02:01:44]	 I don't know even who's here or who I'm insulting, but let me unburden myself on this subject.
[02:01:44 - 02:02:00]	 Van Morrison put it very, very well, no guru, no method, no teacher, just you and me and Mother Nature in the garden,
[02:02:00 - 02:02:04]	 in the garden wet with rain.
[02:02:04 - 02:02:08]	 I think all religion is a con game.
[02:02:08 - 02:02:14]	 I think that all esoterica is a con game.
[02:02:14 - 02:02:27]	 I think that the real secrets are self-protecting and that speaking is the way to find.
[02:02:27 - 02:02:33]	 And take yourself more seriously.
[02:02:33 - 02:02:41]	 You are the vessel, the stage, and the theater of your transformation.
[02:02:41 - 02:02:48]	 The mushroom was very explicit on this point to me was it said, and I quote,
[02:02:48 - 02:02:58]	 "For one human being to seek enlightenment from another is like a grain of sand on the beach,
[02:02:58 - 02:03:04]	 seeking enlightenment from another grain of sand."
[02:03:04 - 02:03:11]	 And my interpretation of that is that we're all as good as the best among us.
[02:03:11 - 02:03:15]	 There is no hierarchy among human beings, you know.
[02:03:15 - 02:03:19]	 If you've got the chromosomes, you're into the game.
[02:03:19 - 02:03:32]	 And the task then is to accentuate primary experience, the here and now, teachings which come from far away,
[02:03:32 - 02:03:36]	 unsubstantiated rumors that circulate among the people.
[02:03:36 - 02:03:40]	 Magicians have always worked the marketplace.
[02:03:40 - 02:03:42]	 It's older than Ur.
[02:03:42 - 02:03:55]	 But this kind of mystery is absolutely authentic, and having once found it, I stopped searching for other authentic mysteries.
[02:03:55 - 02:04:02]	 So I don't know what lies behind the deeper levels of the salachandra tantra.
[02:04:02 - 02:04:07]	 I don't know what lies behind the inner secrets of the lion, Kauina.
[02:04:07 - 02:04:13]	 But I do know that this one thing fulfills the bill.
[02:04:13 - 02:04:19]	 It's real, and you only need one doorway to enter into the palace of the human.
[02:04:19 - 02:04:24]	 So do I assess about numbering doorways?
[02:04:24 - 02:04:28]	 That doesn't seem to be the way to do it.
[02:04:28 - 02:04:40]	 Yeah.
[02:04:40 - 02:04:47]	 I'm not sure I understand the question.
[02:04:47 - 02:04:53]	 Yeah.
[02:04:53 - 02:05:00]	 Right.
[02:05:00 - 02:05:04]	 I've actually never combined the DMT and psilocybin.
[02:05:04 - 02:05:09]	 I have smoked DMT at the top of an LSD trip.
[02:05:09 - 02:05:15]	 That's a young man's game.
[02:05:15 - 02:05:17]	 If you're interested in that, hurry up.
[02:05:17 - 02:05:20]	 It's like climbing the Matterhorn.
[02:05:20 - 02:05:30]	 What happened to me, well, I did it several times, but I'll tell you a story just for your education, maybe, but I'm using it, perhaps.
[02:05:30 - 02:05:42]	 I once, in melting cities, was a landlord in Berkeley many years ago, and that's sufficient.
[02:05:42 - 02:05:50]	 And everybody left one Easter vacation or Thanksgiving vacation,
[02:05:50 - 02:05:58]	 and so I decided I would do this acid trip I'd been planning and smoke DMT at the top of the trip.
[02:05:58 - 02:06:07]	 And so I did, and I did, and I had this very long involved DMT trip and the L's and all.
[02:06:07 - 02:06:16]	 It was just totally out of control, and at the very height of this thing, this woman who I rented to upstairs,
[02:06:16 - 02:06:27]	 who I thought had gone home to Minneapolis, came back and arrived by cab and came pounding up the stairs with these two suitcases,
[02:06:27 - 02:06:35]	 led herself into the house and ran around to my bedroom door and peed on the door.
[02:06:35 - 02:06:46]	 And, you know, you don't know me that well, but 500 miles up the jungle river smoking a joint and a stick cracked 50 feet away,
[02:06:46 - 02:06:49]	 the first thing I do is hide the joint.
[02:06:49 - 02:07:00]	 And a very paranoid person, being, you know, 500 miles of acid, smoking DMT, and suddenly having this woman.
[02:07:00 - 02:07:10]	 And I literally, I had some kind of a coronary, and I leaped off my bed and I landed on my feet.
[02:07:10 - 02:07:14]	 And, you know, if you want, you may try this.
[02:07:14 - 02:07:29]	 Something about this enormous splash of adrenaline added into the DMT, added into this sudden, incredible physical exertion.
[02:07:29 - 02:07:42]	 It was as though I ripped the membrane, I ripped the membrane, and I was now standing in my room, but I had dragged this trip through with me.
[02:07:42 - 02:07:52]	 And the room was full of them, ricocheting on the floor and I had them, they were hanging on me like measles.
[02:07:52 - 02:08:09]	 And I was literally turning me around in the room, and also simultaneously one of these machines had been dragged through into my bedroom.
[02:08:09 - 02:08:19]	 At the same time, it was like about the sidewalk like this, and it had all kinds of, it was fast, it was opalex, and glassy, and strange.
[02:08:19 - 02:08:30]	 But what was important about it was it had that kind of a fax that it talked on it that was clicking, like this.
[02:08:30 - 02:08:42]	 And every time it would click, it would launch a small plastic jib across the room that had an alien letter written on it.
[02:08:42 - 02:08:56]	 And these little plastic jibs were ricocheting off the wall and piling up and I was standing up tall over the wall looking at the situation.
[02:08:56 - 02:09:06]	 And then, when I was on the door again, I staggered over to the door, which was the sliding wooden door, and I just threw it open.
[02:09:06 - 02:09:36]	 And I looked at her and said, "Jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jibby, jib
[02:09:36 - 02:09:43]	 And I just said, I'm going to stay here until I'm dead or it's over. And I did.
[02:09:43 - 02:09:55]	 But it was, I mean, you're supposed to learn something about anthropology, not experience.
[02:09:55 - 02:10:16]	 [laughter]
[02:10:16 - 02:10:31]	 Well, this thing which I've done several times with Dr. Union in various states, this language thing, that's glossolalia, and it's called speaking in tongues.
[02:10:31 - 02:10:39]	 But the good news is the fundies don't have any kind of monopoly on this.
[02:10:39 - 02:10:47]	 Speaking in tongues is as old as human beings. It's shamanic. It's paleolithic, and it's done all over the world.
[02:10:47 - 02:10:54]	 And I think that, well, psilocybin will induce it spontaneously.
[02:10:54 - 02:11:04]	 And I think, to add to my little scenario yesterday about hunting, walking, and tripping, we could also add in there, and talking.
[02:11:04 - 02:11:14]	 Probably long before the invention of what we call meaning, people amused each other with funny noises.
[02:11:14 - 02:11:14]	 People would say, "Ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee, ee,
[02:11:14 - 02:11:36]	 And people would say, "Mmm, yee, mmm, yee, mmm, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha." And so, being physiologically set up for the production of small mouth noises, notice that language is a very primitive form of telepathy.
[02:11:36 - 02:11:48]	 Because here's how it works. I have an idea. I look in my dictionary. I translate the idea into what we call English.
[02:11:48 - 02:11:59]	 I then move my lips and throat muscles and aspirate in a certain way, and I send an acoustical pressure wave across the space,
[02:11:59 - 02:12:17]	 which enters into the holes on the side of your head. Your brain reconstructs this acoustical wave and tries to match the incoming pattern against an inferior dictionary, which has been learned.
[02:12:17 - 02:12:30]	 Now, if your dictionary and my dictionary are congruent, lo and behold, you can reconstruct my thought in your mind.
[02:12:30 - 02:12:39]	 Now, if the thought is something utterly straightforward, like, "Please shut the door," ambiguity doesn't enter.
[02:12:39 - 02:12:55]	 But notice that one of the most uncool things we can do with each other is to say to somebody, "Would you mind explaining to me what it was that you just did?"
[02:12:55 - 02:13:02]	 Or, "Would you mind explaining to me what it was that I just did?"
[02:13:02 - 02:13:10]	 And then they say, "Oh, shit, now the cover is blown. I haven't the paint is done. We've been winning."
[02:13:10 - 02:13:19]	 So, language, spoken language, small mouth noises, is a very imperfect way of communicating.
[02:13:19 - 02:13:34]	 This is why I think that the visual initiation in the DMT is they taught us language. This is not the first initiation from the L.
[02:13:34 - 02:13:43]	 The first initiation occurred up only a thousand years ago. The second initiation is occurring now.
[02:13:43 - 02:13:51]	 First they gave us language. Now they're going to show us how to make that language visible.
[02:13:51 - 02:14:04]	 And you see, if you and I both read the same page of a book, we can then have an enormous argument about what's written there.
[02:14:04 - 02:14:17]	 But if you and I both step into a place where a piece of sculpture is being exhibited, we may argue about what the piece of sculpture means, but we agree what it is.
[02:14:17 - 02:14:28]	 We see it. We see it. And when we communicate with each other and understand each other, we instinctively reach for visual metaphors.
[02:14:28 - 02:14:38]	 I see what you mean. Look here, fella. She painted a picture. His words were so beautiful.
[02:14:38 - 02:14:44]	 It means that we really associate meaning with seeing something.
[02:14:44 - 02:14:51]	 And I believe that we're on the brink of a transformation of how we communicate with each other.
[02:14:51 - 02:14:58]	 And I don't know whether we're going to require a prosthesis that is electronic or something like that,
[02:14:58 - 02:15:11]	 or whether we can invent drugs which will allow us the cerebral cortex to switch its linguistic analysis from the audio channel to the visual channel.
[02:15:11 - 02:15:18]	 It's very suggestive that these tricks of the art are in the two parts of the brain.
[02:15:18 - 02:15:25]	 And I think that we're on the brink of transforming our ability to communicate again.
[02:15:25 - 02:15:31]	 It seems to me that I'm not really making that claim. I've been talking a lot about this for a while now.
[02:15:31 - 02:15:37]	 Maybe I'm just being a little bit naive. But I think I'm getting the screen on my screen.
[02:15:37 - 02:15:46]	 [inaudible]
[02:15:46 - 02:15:54]	 Well, yeah. I mean, what was said was that using LSD and having used DMT,
[02:15:54 - 02:16:01]	 one can begin to trip into DMT like the mentioned on LSD.
[02:16:01 - 02:16:06]	 This certainly seems reasonable to me. I haven't had that specific experience.
[02:16:06 - 02:16:10]	 But there is something you can do with psilocybin.
[02:16:10 - 02:16:15]	 There's another technique if you don't like what's happening on a mushroom tree.
[02:16:15 - 02:16:35]	 You can say to it, be MDMA. And it will. No problem. You can say to it, be LSD. And it will. It has no problem.
[02:16:35 - 02:16:38]	 I didn't try that.
[02:16:38 - 02:16:52]	 You want to be sure before you summon the genie. Let me say one more thing about this language thing,
[02:16:52 - 02:17:05]	 because I think nature is always our model. No matter how deep into technology we go, nature will provide a non-topic model.
[02:17:05 - 02:17:14]	 Well, it just so happens that in this area of communication, nature has provided a wonderful non-topic model,
[02:17:14 - 02:17:20]	 and that is the way in which swiz and octopi communicate.
[02:17:20 - 02:17:27]	 Swiz and octopi, as you know from watching far too much TV, can change color.
[02:17:27 - 02:17:33]	 But you may think this is camouflage. It's not camouflage.
[02:17:33 - 02:17:45]	 Octopi change color in order to communicate. Octopi don't generate language. They are language.
[02:17:45 - 02:17:57]	 Think of an octopus. It's soft body. It can fold and unfold itself like an antler, and it folds various parts of its body very rapidly.
[02:17:57 - 02:18:07]	 It also can make its body tissue smooth and rubbery or rugose and rough, and it can undergo all these color changes,
[02:18:07 - 02:18:13]	 splotches, stripes, spreading, pastel, so forth and so on.
[02:18:13 - 02:18:22]	 These behaviors of the octopus are under the genetic control of its linguistic intentionality.
[02:18:22 - 02:18:33]	 It doesn't make words. It becomes words. And when one octopus encounters another, by the mere act of beholding each other,
[02:18:33 - 02:18:43]	 they say, "Aha, you haven't eaten recently. You're having too much sex. You've been traveling," and so forth and so on.
[02:18:43 - 02:18:54]	 But the octopus becomes its form. It wears language on its surface the way we wear our clothing.
[02:18:54 - 02:19:05]	 And this system of communication is so important to the octopus that those species that have evolved into the very deep parts of the ocean,
[02:19:05 - 02:19:16]	 the so-called abyssal octopi where no light ever reaches, have evolved phosphorescent organs all over their bodies
[02:19:16 - 02:19:25]	 and eyelid-like membranes all over their bodies so that in the absolute darkness of the abyssal ocean,
[02:19:25 - 02:19:33]	 they communicate by flashing grammar and syntax to each other across the abyssal depth.
[02:19:33 - 02:19:38]	 They are free in the imagination. And I think this is where we're headed.
[02:19:38 - 02:19:42]	 We are going to make that model of communication our model.
[02:19:42 - 02:19:49]	 Psychedelics, technology, and visionary magic will show how this can be done.
[02:19:49 - 02:19:55]	 Now, we do that now. We flash and we blink. The system will show itself.
[02:19:55 - 02:19:59]	 No, you're right. The human who's face is like this.
[02:19:59 - 02:20:09]	 In your vision that we wear clothing not because that means a higher body, but to signify color, culture, and tension.
[02:20:09 - 02:20:11]	 We do that now. We're working on it.
[02:20:11 - 02:20:25]	 That's right. You see, no other animal has a face. A face is like a little piece of squid skin that we're wearing where we can transmit all of these.
[02:20:25 - 02:20:36]	 Once I was in India and I was cornered. This guy, I was loaded actually on Nestle, and this guy swam aboard my houseboat.
[02:20:36 - 02:20:41]	 And normally I just would run these guys off because they were thieves and beggars.
[02:20:41 - 02:20:49]	 But I was so loaded, so I couldn't do anything but sit there. And this guy came up to me and sat down and crossed her.